connect 2 different wire gauge to pos and neg speaker terminal


what happens if say Kimber kable 12 tc to pos and lowes 10 gauge grounding wire to neg side or 12 tc biwire  to pos and lamp cord to neg
chalmersiv
@almarg this has become a fascinating thread. I’ve a quick question:
I’ve built a few cables in consultation with Steve (williewonka) and his ideas. Basically, the neutral in his cables is doubled and wrapped around the signal or hot conductor. My question is this: to lessen inductance, typically cables are tightly twisted, since the induced magnetic field is strongest further out. If the two conductors are spaced widely enough apart, will this also lessen the effects of induction? What about orientation? I'm under the impression that cables crossing at right angles won't induce currents in each other.

Thanks. I’m trying to make sense of all this as well. I do like the performance of Steve’s design. I’d like to understand the ’why’ a bit more.
Hi Todd,

Thanks for your comments and your interest. Steve’s approaches, such as what you’ve described, sound like good ones to me. Regarding your questions:

Wider spacing of the two conductors will increase inductance and decrease capacitance.

The reason that inductance decreases when the conductors are twisted together, or at least brought closer together, is that since the currents in the two conductors are moving in opposite directions (one toward the load and one toward the source, at any given time, with the directions alternating between each half cycle of the signal in the case of AC), the magnetic fields created by those currents are in opposite directions and tend to cancel each other if the conductors are close together. To the extent that those fields do not cancel, the impedance presented to the signal will increase as the rate of change of the signal (i.e., its frequency) increases. For further explanation the Wikipedia writeup on Lenz’s Law may be helpful.

Regarding capacitance, a capacitor consists basically of two conductive plates separated by a non-conductive dielectric, with each of the two terminals of the capacitor connected to one of the plates. As explained in the Wikipedia writeup on capacitance the closer those plates are to each other the greater the amount of capacitance, everything else being equal. Similarly, cable capacitance presents itself as a shunt (aka parallel) phenomenon between the two conductors, and therefore increases as the conductors become closer together. While inductance and resistance present themselves as series phenomena.

In general, inductance is most likely to be significant in the case of speaker cables, to an increasing degree if the impedance of the speaker is low at high frequencies. (See my first post in this thread). Resistance may also be a significant factor in a speaker cable, of course, especially if the speaker has low impedance at many or most frequencies. Capacitance will usually be unimportant in the case of a speaker cable, unless it is very high, in which case it can cause problems for the amplifier. Especially if the amplifier is solid state and therefore most likely has low output impedance, and uses significant amounts of feedback, in which case even destructive oscillations can occur if the capacitance is extremely high.

In general, resistance and inductance will be unimportant in the case of a line-level interconnect, aside from the possibility that the resistance and inductance of the ground/signal return conductor can make a difference with respect to ground loop-related low frequency hum or high frequency buzz or noise, if the components involved are susceptible to ground loop issues. Capacitance can be important in the case of a line-level interconnect, especially if the output impedance of the component providing the signal is high. The interaction of that output impedance and cable capacitance will form a low pass filter, whose rolloff will usually begin in the ultrasonic or RF region, and therefore be inconsequential, but if those parameters are too high the filter can start rolling off and/or introducing phase shifts at frequencies that are low enough to have audible consequences.

For a given cable type, all of those parameters are of course proportional to length.

All of this, btw, pertains to analog cables.  Completely different considerations and effects come into play in the case of digital cables.

And yes, crossing cables at right angles, or at least minimizing how much of their lengths are parallel and closely spaced, is good practice and will minimize or eliminate any effects the corresponding signals might otherwise have on each other.

Best regards,
-- Al

Speaking of DIY speaker cables.

Here is an interesting post from Charles Hansen.

Bill Waslo is Right - Your Amp is Oscillating
If a solid-state amp is running hot for no apparent reason, it is almost *always* because it is oscillating - usually in the MHz range - so you will never hear it.

The fact that it does so with certain configurations of speaker cables is simply due to the capacitance of those cables. The vast majority of solid-state power amplifiers have an emitter-follower circuit in its output stage. Nominally this has a maximum voltage gain of <1, so there is no way for it to oscillate.

But bipolar transistors turn out to have a mechanism whereby a capacitive load at the output causes an emitter-follower to have a negative input impedance at the base, and the darned thing will oscillate. (This is the basis of the well-known Colpitts oscillator circuit.)

That is clearly what is happening with your amplifier. Normally amplifier manufacturers do all sorts of things to prevent this from happening, including using an inductor at the output (to isolate the amplifier from the capacitive load) and adding Zobel networks (to "swamp out" potential capacitances that can cause problems). Many of these band-aids degrade the sound quality, but it is better to have a mediocre amp that works than a great sounding amplifier that doesn’t work... :-)

I am extremely surprised that your McIntosh would do this. It’s not like it was designed by some beginner in his garage. But clearly they have dropped the ball on this particular design. I would contact them to see if they have an update.

All of this first became a well-known problem with the introduction of the very first "high-end" speaker cable - imported from Japan by Polk Audio (!), it was called "Cobra Cable" and it looked a lot like Kimber Kable, with many fine strands woven together - much in the same way a rope is woven. All of those strands create a very high capacitance, and Cobra Cable blew up many, *many* high-end amplifiers.

https://www.audioasylum.com/forums/amp/messages/22/220668.html

Hansen responded to this posted message.

What I didn’t know

You know, I never knew that by tri-wiring speakers that it would create a heavier load on the amplifier but it appears to be true. At least in my case. If you look at some of my latest posts I was having trouble with heat generation in my McIntosh 7270 that powers my Alon V's that are tri-wired with Alon's Black Orpheus cables.
https://www.audioasylum.com/forums/amp/messages/22/220657.html