The Levinson Sound?


I have never listened to a Mark Levinson amp, but am curious as to what sound characteristics they have, especially the older amps from the 90's. How do they compare to say Pass Labs amps? Any info would be appreciated.
333jeffery
@jafant Do you know if the No. 383 Integrated Amp has the cap issue like th other "3" series products?

I am not an ML expert by any means but my gut feeling tells me that this problem was limited to the 331, 332 & 333. The design of the electronics changes significantly with the later models. Most notably is the choice of moving away from T0-3 type power transistors. From a service perspective the newer design makes it so much easier to service. To remove a board that has T0-3 transistors requires un-soldering ALL the transistors because the legs of the transistors pass through the heat sink. (a real PITA). However, the newer designs with internally mounted transistors have a caveat. If they fail, they can fail violently and often will vaporize a board. I have seen pics of some of these boards. Not pretty at all. I think I said in another post that the ML amps are basically controlled lightning. They have massive power reserves that will destroy if unchecked.

The large caps on the 331-333 were problematic from a manufacturer perspective (Phillips). Oddly enough ML still chooses to install Phillips caps where most of the self-service community will install slightly larger Cornell-Dublier caps.

ML has identified a few counter-measures. One includes installing mylar strips on the frame of the chassis. I imagine the caps swell and contract, especially at initial power up. The caps are strapped to the chassis. I think the outer casing would eventually wear through the blue plastic coating causing the metallic can of the cap to contact the grounded chassis. If a cap is failing internally it would provide a path to ground for large amounts of current. This will heat up a cap quickly and then you get the black goo volcano. Don’t try to order these $0.25 "safety strips" from ML. They wont sell them. Don’t try and order large, small or so much as a decal from ML. They will not sell them.

Then there are a few other items that ML identified as failure points. These include soft-start resistors, small bypass caps and mid-level power supply caps at various locations.

I think by the time you get into the newer models such as the 336 and higher the cap problem had been well identified and fixes were already in place during assembly.

This however does not mean it cannot happen to ANY amp with large cans like the ML. As caps get older they start to become resistive. Resistance causes further heating and evaporation of electrolytic material. It becomes a run away train that cannot be stopped. If you have a ML amp with OLD large can caps by Phillips then be cautious and be prepared to spend a nice chunk of cash to make it right.
Thank You- clemvice
agreed- the No. 585 Integrated is very sweet. It is on my must -demo list to be sure. Do you own this ML amp?
Happy Listening!
Man, you are very informed on these power amps- generatorlabs.
Must be a cool project to work on these beautiful beasts!
I look forward in reading more about your listening impressions, muscial selections within your system.
Happy Listening!
Thank you for the kind words Jafant.
I wish I could say this was a pet project for me. 
These legacy amps still command a good amount of cash.
If I could buy more of them I would but people know ML quality and hang on to them. I wouldn't touch a newer, recent, amp. You will not find one at bargain prices. You certainly won't find service manuals floating around. If I can't work on it I don't want to own it. I don't think any of the original innovators are involved with this line anymore either.

If I find a bargain I jump on it. For example I bought a pristine Adcom amp and preamp on Craiglist the other day for $100 with the knowledge that it was broken. With under $12 in mosfets and 2 caps, I brought them back to life. I jumped on it because it was a Nelson Pass design, I wanted to see it for myself and I knew there were service documents floating around.
My sensible side will not let me go too far off the deep end. 
I am more of a practical enthusiast, improving those things I can get my hands on at a decent price.

As for my listening impressions: I primarily use this amp in a listening room that also serves as a recording studio. Yeah I know, over-kill! But even studio monitors with 10" drivers can present a challenge in an environment where the source signal can be very raw. I spend a lot of time in that room so when not behind my console the amp is pleasantly working in the background providing rich, room filling sound. There is something amazing about an amplifier that does not have to flex its muscle. It will produce complex passages with no effort ,especially on the low end. The 300 Series produces a very musical, non-fatiguing sound. Those that have properly working specimens will not let them go. Those that do let them go often regret it. The only group that remains pissed off at ML are those that have a great piece of gear but find it unreasonable to spend $1200 - $1500 to get it serviced. A lot of audio shops turn the repair work away because they know they cannot get support, service manuals etc.Those that are in that situation, walk away quickly and trade in for newer, hassle free options. I don't think it should be that way. Look at all the old McIntosh, Krell, Dynas etc that remain in service today. They are like that because the respective manufacturers allow their gear to live in infamy with proper manuals, parts channels, etc made available to the public. I wish ML had the foresight to take down the wall of silence they put up. For those who live in other countries, I challenge you to call an "AUTHORIZED" ML service center and ask if you can buy a service manual. I really want to believe things in the ML world may be different in other countries.
jafant

Hello,

I've got the Mark Levinson 335 since 2007, no problem, no electronics review

the capacitors are NOT PHILIPS, they are SPRAGUE, except for error, they are blue

again I repeat, that only the first series 331,332 and 333 are equipped with PHILIPS capacitors

the series 334, 335 and 336 the problem was solved with other capacitors, in Portugal who has this series has not yet repaired it.

Happy Listening !

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