Most forgiving high end speaker 10k-20k?

03-09-12: Honest1
Interesting about the Daedalus... a couple years ago, I got a chance to hear them at someone;s house. My immediate impression was that they were very bright and fatiguing in the high frequencies.

While I don't question your perceptions under whatever circumstances existed at the time, including room acoustics, source material, etc., there is no way that the Daedalus speakers, the recent ones at least, can be characterized as bright and fatiguing. Their treble, IME and that of many other Daedalus owners who have posted about them here and elsewhere, is one of their strongest attributes, combining speed and detail with a very natural sound that is easy to listen to.

I should mention, also, that the Ulysses model I have has a three-position tweeter level control on the back, which can provide a slight cut or boost to the treble (indicated as 1 db) if necessary to compensate for problematic room acoustics. Perhaps the owner of the speakers you listened to had it set to the boost position unnecessarily? In my case, btw, I've been sufficiently pleased with the treble balance in the neutral position of the switch that I've never even tried the other positions.

Regards,
-- Al

While i can see the point of trying to make poor recordings sound better to make more music worth listening to, and i think you can find many forgiving speakers, but will you forgive yourself for a speaker that does not show you what is recorded ? Surely the only way it can correct a bad recording is by removing information or changing it, so what will it do with good recordings vs an accurate and revealing speaker? I am more and more leaning towards thinking that 'detail is king' and if you truly present enough accurate detail then other much sought after attributes like soundstage, timbre, etc will fall into place and that emotional connection to the music will be there. I dont think it comes from forgiving speakers for myself. I tried that route to some extent and more music certainly is pleasant, but it made me sleepy.

Honest1 - As a Daedalus Ulysses owner, I'd bet that the Daedalus speakers you auditioned where not properly broken in. I've had my Ulysses for about 4 months now, and initially, I was ready to give up on them... but armed with good advise from fellow Audiogoner "Raquel", I put my Ulysses thru a formal & regimented break-in process for approx. 200 hours. The break-in process was a PIA, but now the brightness & fatigue you referenced is gone and they are making beautiful music.

BTW, my previous speaker prior to the Ulysses were Harbeth M-40.1's. Another great and very forgiving speaker... more forgiving that the Daedalus Ulysses IME, but also a bit darker in presentation. Both outstanding speakers, just different flavors. I could be happy with either one.

Detail can't happen without accuracy.

Accuracy can be pretty or ugly.

An accurate image of a pretty girl is pretty.

An accurate image of Medusa ain't so pretty.

What happens to the pretty girl if you apply the same tweaks necessary to make Medusa presentable?

So clearly accuracy and detail is desirable but still can be a double edged sword. Recordings are what they are. They typically range from mostly good to not so good, but few worth listening to are the audio Medusa, ie few have no sonic merit at all.

There is an up and down side to almost everything.

Don't have the experience to comment on all (or even most) of the suggestions – but I did in fact seek to answer that very question myself, and ended up with the Verity Parsifals. Lesser recordings sound great. Exquisite recordings sound exquisite. But, certainly and overlooking upstream electronics for the moment, room interaction is likely the single most important factor regarding how any given speaker will sound at any given moment. So, considering speakers in the abstract – apart from the "ecosystem" in which they will be asked to perform – is likely not capturing much of what is material to the question.

Just as an example, my listening space is pretty confined, has a nasty (and unfortunately untreatable) first reflection point on one speaker, but an open room on the other (so pronounced asymmetry), and a limited ability to pull them too far off of the front wall. Thus, the Parsifals "fit" in my space better than many: adjustable front- or rear-firing bass modules gives fantastic flexibility and the heavily-loaded midrange driver (providing the lush and wonderful midrange for which they are known) is wired to roll off naturally without imposed crossover points resulting in a relatively "beamy" presentation. That is, the dispersion pattern coming off the midrange is relatively narrow. This may be a huge disadvantage in some spaces, but where first order reflection points are a real issue, it is very helpful. Finally, they're real small. As much as I'd love to play with the likes of Avalon, Maggies, Wisdoms, etc., just plain don’t have the real estate. Thus, even before hearing them, their design rendered them an almost-ideal prospective “fit” for my space.

In sum, I wouldn’t purport to have The Answer – and there likely isn’t one – but there are certainly many factors to consider. I’ve settled on my answer, but certainly not one size fits all.