Not wasting my time on new Digital


Well guys, I have disappointing news:

Getting all hyped being a tech guy, tried out a new $9000 top flying Integrated CD player, with the apparently best design and parts including Anagram algorithms and ……..

I don’t know boys, this is my second disappointing experience with new digital gear.
I am not going to mention any manufactures that I have been disappointed with.
I have a very nice system to my ears to name a few products including Sonus Faber (Electa Amator mk1 to be exact) Apogee’s, Audio research and more…….

Decided to try some new sources of course and I was told all sort of things and parts and man oh man, the reviews and well to my ears other than my original Oracle turntable and my newer VPI table, my older DAC’s sound much more musical. WHY? WHY? WHY?

New technology, new ideas, new designs, new engineering and we see to be going behind rather that forward. I still like my original Theta Gen V and even my Bel Canto DAC for a fraction of the cost, even my Micromega DAC hands down.

Anyway are there any other people experience the same thing, by the way I have tried some very serious stuff and out of the pricy gear…meridian and Spectral (Spectral SDR-2000 with no upgrades and still sounds amazing) stays on top of my listing.

Appreciate any input.

Cheers - rapogee
rapogee
Viridian...I have a test CD (put out by Dennon) that has a track with a tone having amplitude of one LSB. It is completely inaudible, although my spectrum analyser, looking at the electrical signal, picks it up so I know it is there. I don't much care what might lie ten to twenty dB lower.

Oh, and that is a 16 bit CD. DVDs are 256 times better.
Viridian...Please explain why I should care about sounds that are ten to twenty dB softer than what is audible.

Unlike many sonic characteristics that are near to the heart of audiophiles, dynamic range is very easy to measure. Have you ever actually done this?
Drubin: What i was saying is that electronic componentry has a higher level of time delay and signal smearing than even just a reasonably well designed piece of cabling. Sean
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Eldartford,

Ditto! I was about to say the same thing.

The problem starts with the recordings. I have witnessed A-B tests between a SOTA ($60K+) vinyl setup and certain Digital only to find out that, with the same record title, some sound better on the Digital and some better on the Vinyl.

Believe or not!

Regards,
Alex
El, I think you miss the point. To answer your last question first, I have not measured dynamic range in source components or in in-room replay, which is why I provided the link. Did you bother to look at it? But what is your point here? Must one actually make the measurements oneself to understand the concepts behind them?

As far as dynamic range is concerned, you simply misread my statement that, in analog, not digital, replay, sounds can be heard 10db to 20db into the noise floor and this leads to analog replay having a greater dynamic range than redbook CD and is quite audible. Where, as you assert, did I say that sounds 10 to 20db below what is audible are things that you should "care" about? Intentionally misreading is simply obfuscation. My only point about digital replay was that cutting off signal below the least significant bit, throws away information. And I also pointed out that the addition of dither can recapture at least some, of this information. Show me where I said that this disregarded information is audible?

Your point is that the information, being overtly inaudible, makes it of no value. This may well be true and I cannot take issue with your assertion. However, I am not at all convinced that some of the information that "reads" as room tone and ambiance does not fall below what is considered to be the standard limit of audibilty. Some will argue that our listening room noise levels, sometimes running as high as 40db (and yes, I have measured this), will just swamp these small changes. Again, as with analog replay, we hear into the noise floor of our listening rooms, as ambient noise is not correlated with the audio signal, it is easier for our sensory gating mechanisms to diminish. To be clear, I am not saying that this is the case, just that it might be possible.

We have also heard similar arguments about the 20K upper limit of CD replay. If it is inaudible, who cares if we throw it away? And yet, there are still many that believe that information above 20k is necessary to maintain the integrity of the signal and there are audible consequences to eliminating this information. I think that a lot of it comes down to hearing acuity as well. A young person may hear well in excess of 20K, as we grow older the upper limit of hearing diminishes. But it does not always completely disappear, it simply rolls off. There are individual limits to low level hearing as well. I am not so presumptuous as to think that, because I cannot hear something, that others cannot either. So what does not matter to me, may be quite important to others.