Spending on dac vs amp

Spend only $250 for a used DAC? Geez, how horrible that will be! And in a system of otherwise fairly decent performing products? NOT! You're pushing your luck to find any DAC, new or used, for less than $500, and probably closer to $1000, that will have any chance to bring the music to any level of reality that you would expect the other components to achieve. Spend more on the DAC and look for a good deal on a used CDP for $100-200. The difference between DACs is magnitudes greater than the difference between transports.

And $3000 for an integrated? What? A top performing line stage from ARC (LS5), CJ (Premier 10/14), BAT (VK5) from 10-15 years ago, can be had in the $1000-1500 range that if matched to a SS amp from the same company or others like from McCormack, would easily be less than $3k and pretty much destroy any $3k integrated amp. And you'd have $500 or so extra to get a better DAC.

There are so many phenomenal speakers under the $2k range that for an $8k system, I think you will be mightily impressed. No need to spend more at this point.

I'm a huge proponent in putting top-tier cables in a system, but I'd start with DIY or low-cost speaker cables and stock power cords. The only exception would be to invest a few hundred for an IC between the line stage and amp where it makes a major difference with line stages like the ones I mentioned.

FWIW, I just bought/received the Emotiva XDA-1 DAC for $299 (shipped w/30 day money back trial).

I’ve got it connected to my VTL IT-85 (80watt, EL34, Integrated) which are driving a pair of Dynaudio Special 25’s. Don’t laugh until you try it… it sounds really good. For sources I’m feed the DAC with an Apple TV2 and an old Roku Soundbridge as well as a really old HK CDP (as a transport).

In a week or so I’ll drop it into my main rig and see how it holds up to a >$3000 DAC…

I'd recommend finding equipment that you can audition at minimal cost. There are a number of dealers online with very flexible return policies.And there may be local dealers who will allow in-home auditons. Try different combinations of equipment until you hit your sweet spot. With an $8k budget, I'd factor in some return shipping/restocking fees that may be necessary before you hit the right combo. Buying used and reselling here on Audiogon is another way to go about it.

Haven't heard the Emotiva, but I'd generally agree with sentiments here on using a $250 DAC. It all starts with the source and anything lost from the source's signal will prevent your other components from reaching their full potential.

While the statement ”It all starts with the source and anything lost from the source's signal will prevent your other components from reaching their full potential” is true, it is also true that inferior downstream products (pre/amp, speakers) will prevent your source from reaching its full potential.

I tend to agree with Eslaudio related to digital sources. Technology related to digital sources change at a far greater pace than amps, pre’s, speakers (IMHO).

For example the VTL Compact 100’s amps in my main rig are at least 30 years old and still going strong. Whereas my 10yr old Levinson 360s DAC, while still a great piece, has been outpaced by technology. 24/96 was once cutting edge but now we see sample rates for 24/192 with USB inputs, etc… Will the $300 Emotiva replace the $7000 Levinson, most likely not? But the choice also depends on how the stereo is going to be used, (i.e. critical listening or background / streaming music or CD transport). Are there other sources as well?

If you need to compromise on cost I would look at first getting the best speakers, integrated and wires you can afford and then look at the digital source. Cheap doesn’t mean bad. I’ve gotten some really good results with a dyi NOS DAC; not the end all in resolution but very musical.

So in the end it’s a matter of choice and there is no golden ratio on what to spend compared to other components.

Thank you all for the feedback. If I summarize some of the key points, this is what I heard:

- spend the most on the analog components and start with speakers. ($3k)
- work from the speakers down and get a good amp as these should they with me for a while ( up to $2.5k)
- in terms of dac, paying more makes a difference but the pace of innovation is so high that it probably doesn't justify spending too much (no more than $1.5k)
- keep the remainder for good quality speaker cables, psu, and analog interconnection, don't worry about digital interconnects. ( up to $1k)

In addition $8k seems to be more than enough to build a great system.

However ultimately, it is all based on experience ( warm vs transparent, ...) Ratios are there to be changed and challenged. No one size fits all.

Fair summary?