Processor DACs

I chose a long time ago to build a separate system for 2-channel. I have a Denon AVR and B&W 6 series speakers in the home theater system, and although I really need a 5-channel amp to finish it out, I'm not spending any more money on it until I am completely satisfied with my 2-channel system in the basement.
This is not a great option for everyone of course, because not everyone has a spare room for dedicated 2-channel. But most of the +/- $1000 pre-amps out there will best the pre-amp section in an AVR of the same or even slightly higher price point. This is definitely true in my case. And I almost bought an Onkyo, but found a great deal on a Denon at the last moment.

IMO, it is possible for a processor to compete with, or even best, a $1K dac. But it gets expensive. Very. I use a Meridian G68 which, in its stock form, competes fairly well with SOME of the $1k dacs I've heard. But it's current MSRP is around $12K. Ouch.

IMO, my modded G68 bests several of the $1K dacs I've heard, but it has a custom power supply, a Superclock 4, new op amps, new internal wiring, WBT Nextgen connectors, about 10 pounds of custom RFI/EMI shielding, none of the inessential stock circuitry, and an aftermarket apodizing filter. And my G68 is fed by a reclocker with a second(!) Superclock 4. Add all that up and you get... I don't know what you get, but it's a lot to spend. And no, it's NOT worth all the trouble or expense, unless you NEED a digital crossover and room correction. And even then there are better solutions these days than spending upwards of $15K to solve these problems. Those solutions include both hardware (e.g., Trinnov) and software (i.e. computer) alternatives.

IMO, some of the posters have not given sufficient recognition to the value of room correction. When implemented well, room correction can greatly improve resolution, coherence, tonal balance, PRaT, and overall musicality. "Implemented well" is no small task either, as the auto-corrections in several of the processors I know are flawed, to put it politely. Personally I use a professional microphone and Room EQ Wizard to set the room correction filters on my G68. But getting that dialed in took months. Literally.

Just buying a $1K 2 channel dac would save you from plunging down the rabbit hole that I call home.

Again, IMO, IME, YMMV, etc.

Bryon

Mateored, It looks like the Wadia has both balanced and unbalanced out. You could run one set to you amp and the other through something like a Velodyne SMS-1 (then to your sub). It is an and older product but very flexable and you can EQ your sub with it.

I finally got around to bringing my Wadia 121 home from the office and hooking it up to my home system. The goal was to compare the internal DACs on my Anthem AVM-50v with a quality stand-alone DAC like the Wadia. As mentioned above, the main difficulty with this experiment is that there is no simple way to utilize my subwoofer when running the Wadia in analog direct mode through the Anthem. This means that an external DAC would not be a practical long-term solution for me, but I still was anxious to compare it to my processor.

For the comparison, I used my Mac Mini running Pure Music as the source. The HDMI out was run directly into the Anthem (using Audioquest Carbon), which did the analog conversion - with ARC room correction processing turned off. The Wadia was hooked up to the Mac via USB (Pangaea pure silver), and then to the Anthem (via Kimber Hero balanced cables). I disconnected the subwoofer to even the score.

I switched back and forth many times, while listening to a number of different tracks, including some hi-res tracks (Dark Side of the Moon and a Glenn Gould piano concerto) and rebook tracks (e.g. Jerry Garcia Band Live, Lyle Lovett, etc.).

With deep concentration, I could hear some very subtle differences in presentation, and a slightly more solid low-end with the Wadia. However, it was not obvious, and I would have a hard time identifying which DAC was being utilized under normal circumstances. This pleased me, since I was not anxious to figure out a way to upgrade the DAC around the Anthem.

The bottom line for me is that, in my system and in my living room, the ARC software and bass management make a much bigger difference than the external DAC. In addition, I added a PS Audio Power Plant Premier last week, which made an immediate and clear improvement in the sound -- much more than the Wadia.

Mat - if you are using a typical active preamp, then you will probably not hear much difference in ANY DACs. Replace this with a good transformer passive linestage and you will start to hear differences. Also, given that the jitter of the master clock in the digital source is THE MOST IMPORTANT part of any digital playback system, a cheap USB converter or CD transport will not cut it. You might as well buy a $200 DAC. It's more important than the DAC. The better DAC quality will be masked by the jitter.

Steve N.
Empirical Audio