Can you imagine a world without vinyl?

Well I agree with the vinyl-o-philes. When great vinyl recordings and pressings are played back over a great system they absolutely destroy CD's.

And this occurred so seldom (and I will honestly admit I lost a bit of interest in the music I had on my LP's) I took down my system. It wsn't worth the space it was occupying. I had ventured out and bought 'used stuff' and for the most part it was rarely both in good condition and was music I wanted.

I bought newly pressed reissues which I found, for the most part, as often plagued by pressing issues as the vintage stuff (which drove me to distraction in the late 60's and 70's) and often the sound was rarely improved in anyway by the re-mix and process.

What little I think I actually lose from loss of a vinyl playback system, I think I gain from no longer revisiting this issue of format superiority during playback of CD's. CD playback can sound dammed fine, and certainly it is not worthy of the denegration it recieves when the vinyl folks enter the arena. It was in the '80's, and to a lesser degree in the '90's, but thats no reason to rag on it now. If a person does it serves to say far more about themselves than the format!

The recorded music industry as we have know it is dying, the interest in major music formats is dying, the interest in serious stereo systems is dying, and yet we are engaging our energies in picking the bones of bodies in the desert. Go figure.

Albertporter...That depends on the definition of "better".

Johnnantais...You are quite correct that there is great potential for improvement of vinyl-based audio. I know that, because I had DBX records and playback electronics, and I found that all the well known problems of vinyl were drastically reduced by this system. Audiophiles missed the boat on this one, although stupid marketing by DBX played a role. If I had to describe DBX records in a nutshell, I would say that it amounts to dynamic equalization to replace the RIAA curve.

Newbee gets right what Johnnantais misses in my opinion: It's typically the rabid vinylphiles who exagerate the shortcomings of CDs vs. what average digital-friendly audiophiles usually state about the shortcomings of vinyl.

Both formats have their limitations and strengths, but these days the most overheated claims about the inferiority of the other format are promulgated by the vinyl side. So too are most of the rationalizations, omissions, or dismissals of problems inherent in their own pet format also to be found on the vinyl side, as Johnnantais' comments above illustrate -- noise, quite real, is hardly the only such problem with records -- or his and Stevecham's cliched but meaning-free quips about computers and ones and zeroes. (The fact is that the major problems audible with CD sound are analog in origin: jitter- and filter-related primarily. But the basic theory of digital conversion is well-proven, and the remaining practical difficulties are known and addressable.) On the digital side at least work continues to be done in trying to establish higher-rez consumer protocols to supercede Red Book, which implies in part a more honest appraisal of the CD's sonic shortcomings, among other more marketable factors, and that evolution will be ongoing as the physical silver disk increasingly becomes a thing of the past.

And don't for a second try to tell me that the high end industry marketing to audiophiles what is essentially being treated as a 'new' format from a sales standpoint doesn't both drive and feed off much of the vinyl propaganda, same as when CD was first promoted to the general public, only much more expensively (it's not called the high end for no reason after all). Not since then has the high end seen such a bonanza of audiophiles lining up to be convinced once more that they must re-buy their music in a more costly audiophile format yet again, plus all the new gear to play it on. Just witness today's profusion of me-too turntables -- talk about cynical. But that's fine -- I don't have a problem with what is still a cottage industry in the larger scheme of things reaping the benefits of rich boys wanting to play with new toys; that's what the high end is all about.

Let's just not get carried away from reality by all the rhetoric. No matter how much you want to expend on their playback, and no matter how much we might enjoy or fetishize them, records cannot faithfully transmit the sound of a mastertape. Digital has that possibility, as well as more relative practical advantages than you can shake a tonearm at.

Albertporter...That depends on the definition of "better".

Big opinions as always from Eldartford. This has become a multi thread, multi year experience with Dart seeking out LP forums to place his jabs.

Those that have both formats at state of the art agree LP is better, but that doesn't stop Eldartford (who never got it right) from remaining steadfast to his position.

I get really tired of the smart ass attitude and smug assertions, especially from someone who doesn't know what he's talking about.

I guess I need to start going to every forum on digital and abuse everyone about their music instead of interjecting comments that digital has made headway.