KAB 1200 vs. everything else.

12-24-08: Pauly
Tvad, with all due respect you are expecting too much from the Technics. The
KAB modified tables are fine tables, but by sticking on expensive peripherals
(and I use the term peripherals loosely) like a 2K cart and 5K phono you’ll
only end up revealing the SL’s shortcomings; hence your preference for your
3910.

Pauly, your point is lost on me with the examples you use to support your
position.

If you read my post carefully, you will see that I have used cartridges ranging
in price from $250-$2000 . The $2000 cart produces a better result that the
other carts (less distortion, better balance...more pleasing sound overall).

Also, I do not use a $5000 phono. The Heed Quasar retails for $995.

I think Pauly's point, and mine, is that the KAB Technics, although obviously a great value, is limited, arguably not worthy of a $2k cartridge, and possibly not revelatory in comparison to a good CD player, although you'll get arguments, of course, on that.

Personally, I think the KAB fully modded version is one flavor of ice cream comparable to other good value tables in the $2-3k range, IOW, punching above its weight, but not overly so.

Understood.

One must factor in what an SL-12xx series would cost to manufacture if it were developed today? The price for base 1200's today are around $500 US. Add some KAB mods and they go closer to $800-$1000. But it's not that these take on in competition with other sub $1000 decks. No, it's becase Panasonic has been making and selling these units for near 30 years, the large sum of money they put into R&D of not only the SL-12xx series drive system and other parts has be recouped many times over. They now only need to make profit on the cost of direct manufacture of each and since they still sell relatively large sums of these the costs are appropriate.

Kevin is in the right ball park IMO if not a bit high. My belief using my logic of the business model and marketing would say one likey needs to spend minimum $2000 or more to begin seeing units from other makers begin to truly rival or excel the general playback of the SL-12xx series.

But it is a personal thing and being subjective many will have raw opinions on such. But one can't look at the SL-12xx series as just anoth $500-$1000 (with pertinent KAB mods) TT. Pick any cottage maker of note and if they had to invest in R&D around the making of the SL-12xx series today they would likely have to price it at least $2000 but probably closer to $3000 in current dollars to make any real profit on it.

I love my SL-1200MKII with KAB Cardas arm rewire. It impresses me every day I play it. If one had no idea what they sell for they would, likely think it was way more expensive and their opinions would be even more positive. Too many so called audiophiles think " Meh it's $500, how good can it be?" They allow the price to blur the facts that it's a killer TT that will scare or humiliate many other TT's that often get rave reviews.

Less Creative .. I love my Technics SL1210MKII and it shocked lotsa sceptical friends but trust me .. don't compare with a TW Raven One with a good arm .. this is another planet.
I'm sure the SL1200 outclasses many Rega and I think some Gyrodeck/Orbe not well tuned .. maybe some Scout and Scoutmasters (but I don't know these) .. pratically TT around 1000/3000 USD$ expecially if you setup the SL with the fantastic MintLP Tractor but don't push forward

Always IMHO