Seeking turntable upgrade advice

Doug,

When we met, the problems with my analog rig (as I saw it) were:

- low frequency ringing
- slight lack of high frequencies

The ringing was heard by all, the lack of high frequencies wasn't, although I often heard the comment that my tonearm was holding things back.

I tried various things to get rid of the ringing (damping etc) and even asked VPI for advice. Their answer was to increase VTF to 2.5 or higher. This did help but wasn't a total solution.

Having dealt with other issues in my room (which is still not as lively sounding as I'd like) and improved the playback chain, I now want to change my tonearm so I can take full advantage of my cartridge. It's really as simple as that - except for the fact that my table is a VPI and restricted to VPI tonearms (please correct me if I'm wrong). I've purchased a Tri-planar arm and now I need to find a table that is a good match.

I'm not sure I understand everything you're saying about harmonics, but my take-away is that you're suggesting I get a less than detailed tonearm because my system or room can't handle harmonics.

I would also consider an Avid Acutus. I have a lower model and I couldn't be happier after upgrading from a Scout.

Hi Madfloyd,

I think your comments touch on a very important point regarding venturing into made to order audio components, and are worth exploring. In the interest of full disclosure, I need to clarify a comment you made which might be subject to misinterpretation:

I did try to purchase a Galibier but finally gave up (I think Thom is just too busy).

It would appear that after our single exchange, you have self selected yourself out of Galibier ownership (and sadly, out of a Doshi as well). In no way would I try to discourage you, but I think some background on the acquisition process is in order.

The first few conversations with potential clients have very little to do with Galibier models and options. There's too much groundwork to be covered about past experiences and future goals, and skipping over this would be a critical mistake. People like myself, Chris Brady, and Neck Doshi approach our customers as if they have arrived at the end of a long journey.

The fellow who has played the game with mainstream components and who approaches us has more often than not reached a crossroad. Most likely, he is fed up with hi-fi, but at the same time is ambivalent about giving it up. His experiences with mainstream gear (at any price) have not met his expectations. The crossroad he reaches is one of either checking out of hi-fi completely, or branching into the realm of the esoteric - for one last try.

In early contacts with potential clients, we share our collective experiences (aka mistake$), in an attempt to come to an understanding about whether we have a shared vision. Having reached this point, the only remaining question in your mind is whether I can achieve this vision.

This information gathering is a difficult process. I cannot merely ask you what gear you own and what you're contemplating and leave it at that - any more than a doctor can ask a patient if they eat 5 servings of fruits and vegetables daily and expect an honest answer. It takes some careful probing to uncover the truth.

Fortunately, I have a very simple "filter" to help me arrive at the truth: waiting time. While 6 months is at the extreme (but yet very possible as a couple of my current customers will attest), it serves as a good benchmark for both setting of expectations as well as coming to an understanding that a made to order product of this level of precision requires time.

A willingness to wait (something I try my best to NOT exploit), is an expression of someone's entire approach - to both music as well as life. It tells me much about whether we share a common vision.

Examples of long waiting periods abound in other pursuits. Richard Sachs bicycles take on the order of 4 years (http://www.richardsachs.com/dvd.html), and Walker custom guitars run on the order of 7 years (http://www.walkerguitars.com/). Of course, a bit closer to home, there's the Schroeder tonearm.

Regarding your experiences with the Doshi, I have to defer to Doug, since the two of you have shared listening sessions. I need to make a few comments however.

In my experience, components in the Doshi class of gear are frequently blamed for problems elsewhere in the system - in a "shoot the messenger" sort of way. Since Nick designs as any broadcast engineer would, I'm confident that what you did not like had nothing to do with a component mismatch or interface problem.

I've commented in several threads about this, but I need to once more, state categorically, that tracking an XV-1s at 2.5 grams is putting a band aid on a problem, and likely, the high resolution of the Doshi was exposing this problem - this, in addition to others that you and Doug have been diagnosing.

While it's true that no single component can be all things to all people, at the same time, one needs to be very watchful about drawing an erroneous conclusion about a piece of gear. Ask me how I know ...

Good luck in your audio travels.

Cheers,
Thom @ Galibier

SME is a fine product I'm sure but, if you're considering them, the TW and Galibiers are not out of your budget at all. SMEs are expensive! Also, due to the lack of dealer network/advertising I feel you get much more value for the money you do spend on these brands. I think you owe it to yourself to audition them both(and as many others as you have an interest in)before you lay your money down. As for the wait, I don't think anything worth having usually comes quick. (Then again this is coming from someone who spent 12 years in training so he could work like a dog the rest of his life)YMMV!
Thom, if you're out there please remember to keep June 26th open. I'm riding Amtrak to Denver and then driving to Boulder. I look forward to seeing you and your table.

What erroneous conclusion have I arrived to with the Doshi other than it's not to my taste in my system? It's a highly regarded piece of equipment and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with it. Btw, the mismatch for me was not due to the phono stage, but rather the line stage. I spent a fair amount of time and money playing with isolation and tubes, trying it in other systems to get a good feel for its character and I think in my situation I'd be better served by something else. That's allowed, no?

This thread was simply about trying to find a TT match for my Dynavector XV-1s cartridge and Tri-planar arm, not the Doshi.

Thom: for the record, we spoke at least twice - both times you said you would follow up with me in the next few days and both times I never heard back from you. I'm not criticizing the way you operate, but having no idea when I could successfully place an order (let alone receive a unit) is not for me. It's now been a few months and I've given up. Our conversations were very enjoyable and I have no doubt the quality of your products is top notch.

SonofJim: You're are most correct - the SME's are expensive! I'm now considering a Teres 265. Any caveats with this choice? Phono is a Manley Steelhead and preamp is an unknown.