Schroeder Reference Arm

Lew,

I always enjoy our discussions. Being challenged forces me to think more clearly and I need that. (If you knew Paul you'd appreciate how practiced I am at having my thinking challenged, successfully!) Your gracious apology is accepted, though certainly not expected or required.

I'm sure you appreciate that we're not going to subject ourselves to n=1,000 samples of crap just to statistically verify the crap we heard from n=1. Even reviewers don't do that and we're music lovers, not reviewers, even if one of us has a weakness for babbling on forums.

Completely agree that variables between systems and the ultimately subjective nature of music listening limit the extent to which scientific method can be applied when evaluating audio equipment. Subject to those limits however, as I think you agree, one can usefully apply a few basic scientific approaches. I suppose that's all I was trying to suggest.


Raul,

Interesting suggestion regarding tonearm wire. Whether the two designers will adopt it might depend on whether either of them offers their arm with different wire as an option. I imagine Joel and Frank each plan to demonstrate a tonearm that's actually available! If they don't offer the same wire to customers and if having different wire confuses the assessment of other performance characteristics during this (non) shootout, then so be it. :-)

Of course if they do offer the same wire your suggestion makes a great sense.

Dear Dougdeacon: My suggestions were trying to eliminate factors that per se makes a difference if we minimize those factors that has clear influence in the quality performance ( differences ) IMHO we can have a better idea of each one tonearm " real " performance. In this way the main tonearms difference ( yes there are other design factors that makes difference. ) will be the bearing type design.

Anyway just a thought.

Regards and enjoy the music,
Raul.

Raul,
I think we understood that but thanks for clarifying.

Raul,
You are right about trying to minimize the factors between tonearms. However, I agree with Paul about the important fact that using a wire that is not offered to customers would be a serious problem in any type of evaluation. Nobody would know what the "real" tonearm would sound like.
I don't think Frank and I use the same type of cable.
Another aspect of this is that, to a certain extent, the tonearm is "tuned" with the cable I'm using. If I used another wire, I might have to modify other things to get to the sound I want. In that sense, the cable is as important in the global sound result as, say, the wood I use for the armwand, or the material I use for the counterweights, and so on. Any change anywhere modifies the delicate balance between the elements. It can bring the whole thing to a higher level, of course--I'm not implying that I currently have the perfect recipe--and when that is the case, I adopt the change.
Joel

IME you can have 2 identical cartridges in 2 identical tonearms with all parameters being the same. The chance of the sound being the same is very slight. Depending on the break in period, amount of warm up etc the exact same cartridge will sound slightly different.