Cable vs. Electronics: biggest bang for the buck

Referral ASA?, Certainly: "Jadot&Freres" Dijon, "Caves Ropitaux", Mersault, to start off with..the only cure from Bordeaux is a good address in Bourgogne....Cheers.

Detlof, Asa, others: NOW we're getting somewhere (ref to Bourgogne, Detlof's latest post).
Isn't it unfortunate that the guru can only *point* but cannot carry you there; the actual journey cannot be made by proxy, each for, & by oneself... but we all know that, whether we accept it or not.
Asa, I believe I understand the path to which you're pointing.

If I may, so does this thread's iniator, Nrchy -- in fact, his initial post and his latest (16/10) sequel are quite clear.
Fortunately, we all have our opinions on this thread's subject without which, we could fall into Descartes' trap with the donkey: a hungry donkey is contemplating two IDENTICAL hay-stacks, at equal distance, without ANY elements (visual or otherwise) that could draw its attention to one particular stack. The donkey has to START eating one of the two stacks, mouth is watering -- which stack to choose? None, because there is no data allowing it to make the choice, so the donkey will die of hunger :). (nowadays, maybe order out for a pizza!)
Sorry for ranting -- clink!

Wire/cable is an *extruded* product. A $7,000 interconnect is robbery anyway you put it. Doesn't take much to figure that one...

Oh come on Muralaman. I come in this morning and nothing. You say you want "Peace" - which was nice - said you'd thank me if I listed my system publicly and then contacted you - which I did, and nicely, notwithstanding that I'd invited you to contact me three times and you hadn't, and had said I was a "bully" etc. - then you replied, privately, by saying that I was "authoritarian" (read: dictatorial) in my posts, "insulting" and "thin-skinned", and no "thank you" to be seen. So, I take you to task for making absolutist statements in your last post - once more revealed in your position that, somehow, your friend has been converted by your faulty, one-off experiment on a flawed system against your pre-less, mid-level CD system - and not even a burp. Actually, psych was right; it was bread on the water, bamboo across the back, 6ch's koan-like utterances, a bear trap for your ego, so I applaud your restraint. With that said, my points in content remain outstanding.

Thank you detlof. I will call this morning first thing.

Nrchy: I didn't mean to say that you didn't or couldn't hear the difference - I think you DID. But, many people don't and I didn't think it was such a good idea to just say to Muralman that he should just get a piece of Dominus and he'd find out. Nor did I think it would be fair because I know that Muralman wouldn't do that and the expense and hassle would be prohibitive for him given that he probably wouldn't be interested in purchasing it. Yes, a piece of Dominus can be heard on many systems of all different levels, and it can even "do" more in more advanced systems. Again, whether it is worth $7K is a matter of financial relativity. I couldn't afford it, but that doesn't mean that it might not be a valid choice under certain circumstances.

Which leads me to this. Yes, I hear you, Gregm. A way to look at it is symmetry breaking. If you are flying above the earth at a lower altitude, the coastline looks like a jagged line. But higher, it looks more like a staight line. The higher knows the lower, but the lower, if it claims that you can't ever go higher, claims the coastline is only jagged (knowledge is state-specific). Interestingly, if you say to the low flyer that he can remember being lower and the coastline was different then too, so why can't he believe that it might be different higher than he goes, he continues to illogically say, no, there is no higher; thus, by his attachment to his level of sight he limits his own possibilities; the "donkey" sees two equidistant stacks because of the assumptions he brings to them. All the flyers are equal in their potential to fly - they all are in the same type of planes - and it is only your limitation upon yourself that limits how high you can go. "The Kingdom of Heaven is within and all around but men do not see."

Psych, house in the woods, house in the woods, house in the...but the same world is there too, albeit a little quieter (my choice also).

Psych, well now, that is a different consideration, one of pragmaticism and relativity. If a wire is "extruded" - and I take you to mean that because it is less complex in its manufacture then it should be priced less - then what of the situation where someone builds an amp using old design theory that doesn't sound very good vs. someone who designs a wire with new technological know-say, say, electromagntism, that sounds great?

Here's what I think the real problem is, and one I sympathize with: many people believe that the "technology" or design creativity behind wire, regardless of its complexity in structure or lack thereof, does not justify the price vis-a-vis other more complexly constructed "components." And, that wire being so expensive - while admittedly being important in a system, and perhaps even increasingly important in systems as they advance - nonetheless, the DISPARITY in value of construction vs. maginal utility of performance is so imbalanced as to be suspect. Moreover, since wire makers seem to rely on scientific theories ("Golden-stranded") that appear less to do with science and more to do with marketing over-priced wire, this suspicion becomes heightened. In this heightened state, therefore, we should be on guard towards over-priced wire that claims that it will transform your world.

Sounds like a valid argument to me, pragmatically speaking. Yea, if a guy is taking advantage of a good product by hiking the price, then we should perhaps look elsewhere. The problem with that argument is that this is not the country that you live in; capitalism is premised upon the assumption of infinite greed, with the further assumption that lessened demand will result in corrections to over-priced product. Its not robbery to take money from people who pay, which why some people here did not take that tack, instead choosing a "scientific" or "empiric" approach. So, if its not the seller's fault - given the theory of our economy - then it must be the buyer, which is what the real motivation for what alot of people are saying but not saying: not that wire isn't a "component", not that "complexity" is determitive, not that the capitalist system is flawed (which, er, could be your next argument, another kettle of fish), but that people who buy such wire, regardless of its subjective performance even if true, are STUPID for spending that much.

But again, its relative: would the Bangladeshi think that your stereo purchase is STUPID in his/her context? You see what I mean?

I don't spend that amount on wire because I don't believe in a system premised upon infinite greed and don't respect the wire maker who takes advantage of the flaw of that assumption - I simply don't want him to get the rewards of an allegiance to the assumption of infinite greed. I don't think its a good way to set up a system - encouraging everyone to prey upon each other mentally because you won't take the courage to think of something better - so I CHOOSE not to buy it; my philosophy and orientation determines that choice, not an inauthentic "scientific" argument. That doesn't mean, however, that its not great wire in performative terms.