Can you ever go back and be happy?

Call me Planar girl, but I have heard some of the best box enclosed speakers (BMW's, Thiel's, Avalons, Wilson, etc.) and found very few that had the natural and magical sound of real music compared to my MG-1.6's. At the Rocky Mountain Audio Festival this past October, I was truly impressed with the Diamond Tweeter Avalons, but for goodness sakes, they should have been spectacular since they cost close to $35,000! When I now listen to a baffled speaker, it often sounds closed in and unnatural to me. Since I do not listen to head banger music or grundge rock, my MG-1.6's provide me great pleasure with jazz vocals, classical music, swing and bebop acoustic jazz. So for me, yes, it would be very hard for me to go back to a box enclosure speaker.

Something else on this thread piqued my interest. It was mentioning that long time and devoted Sound Lab devotee, Albert Porter, had recently gone from his beloved highly tweaked out and customized Sound Labs to Dali Megaliners in his system. I believe this was shared to show that some of the finest world class box enclosure speakers could offer some of the special qualities of a world class planar. If Albert, of all audiophiles, could be happy with the Megaliners, it would really show that there is sonic heaven after planar speakers.

I just happened to hear Albert, who is a first class gentleman and a scholar, share with some other audiophiles that his major reason for selling his beloved Sound Labs was mainly because of his frustration regarding down time and how long it took to fix certain reliability difficulties. Also, an individual wanted to give him a remarkable amount of money for his very well known and totally customized Electrostatics. I got the distinct impression that Albert truly wanted to replace his Sound Labs with MG-20.1's but he was frustrated that Magnepan, the manufacturer, would not give him a discount or a price reduction of any sort even with his very high profile and wonderful reputation in the audiophile world. I believe it is a fact that Magnepan, regardless if you are a high profile and well known magazine or online reviewer, will not discount or reduce the price of their speakers for anybody. I think this is great because they do not go looking for favorable reviews or perks by winning favors by giving their speakers away for virtually nothing compared to the average audiophile, like you and me, who would have to pay full price to get their product. Magnepan will not allow a dealership to retailers who work out of their home. You have to have a legitimate store front enterprise. All dealers offer their speakers at the same prices because of the policy of Magnepan who prices their speakers at a very reasonable cost compared to both the performance of their speakers and what other speaker companies offer at the same price brackets.

I have a very strong hunch that Albert paid no where close to retail or even wholesale price for his Dali Megaliners. I want to be clear that this is not a personal attack on Albert, for whom I have great respect and admiration. Just trying to make the possible point that he went to a box enclosure speaker, more because he was irritated that Magnepan would not discount their price for him rather than because he was enamored of the sound of the Dali Megaliners. Albert also shared that he was not pleased on the two occasions, including at the Rocky Mountain Audio Festival, that he had heard the Megaliners and was concerned about how he was going to make them sing in his home system. Bless Albert. I am glad he can get what he wants at a very reasonable economical price. I just find it frustrating that as an unknown audiophile, I do not expect nor get price perks because of my status or position. Albert, if my speculations regarding what happened with Magnepan or the pricing of the Dali's is incorrect, I would appreciate if you would share why you chose one speaker over the other.

I did a box vs. planar showdown in my dedicated room a few weeks ago. In my economical fashion, I always said I liked certain aspects of the Vandersteens, and certain qualities of the Magnepans. If only someone made a speaker that combined the best qualities of both!
Well, for my budget, the Eminent Technology LFT-8 fit the bill. After I had them installed, I bought some Vandersteens again to see if I missed the box sound sufficiently to merit keeping a pair on hand, just to hook up when I felt like hearing a box.
nah. Futzed with it for a week. Haven't hooked them up since.
For me, the hybrid planar is the way to go.

Aroma, I didn't know BMW made speakers :-) Some of what you said is quite accurate. As for Albert, only he can decide, but I have reason to believe the jury's still out.
Brian

Brian: Oh yes I would love to come back there and to hear that setup. And I will bring the Versa TT and box of parts to get that up and running too. But I'd like to wait until I decide on the final outcome of the Aesthetix Io/Callisto vs. the Aria preamp when it comes out. This would be a rare opportunity to hear either vs. the Vendetta/Blowtorch. I will let you know ahead of time when I can get back out that way. John

Aroma: Since I suggested people look into Albert's writings here to learn about his progress of the Dali vs. his long time Soundlabs, I feel obligated to respond to many of your points:

1) The issue of why Albert changed from the Soundlabs: Rather than throw a lot of speculation as to the details of price of the competition, reliability of what he owned, or the deals he may have gotten on his latest components, why not let him speak this for himself? You do a big disservice by saying all this and then you close with the comment that if your speculations and comments are incorrect, you would like him to answer why he has changed to the Dalis. With your "delivery", who would be motivated to share in return?

And you've got to be kidding that such an audiophile would not buy the Magnepans because he did not get a discount. Please review his system, add up the cost of the products, and then see if you feel the same way. Is someone who has invested in a highly resolving $100k+ system for years and years going to push aside a product that might be THE perfect match because they did not get a few thousand dollars discount? Just one of his interconnects costs more than your speculative discount "that he did not get". Come on, be serious. Common sense went out the window on this one!

2) The issue of fairness and how "unknown" audiophiles are not treated fairly: Hello! What about magazine reviewers? IMO, they do not provide remotely the value of experience and willingness to share as Albert and others have done here. So please take a closer look at who has special treatment here. If it is to a business's advantage to give certain people a reduction in the cost of a product, then you can be certain they will do so. It's called advertising! And with all the exposure and respect that people like Albert get here, you can be be assured many people, including myself, take very seriously what he writes here. This would indicate that such an audiophile would be a prime candidate for which companies could expose their products. But again, why not let him address this rather than throw out your comments?

3) The issue of Magnepan 20.1s vs. Soundlabs: As I wrote before, I owned the series 3.x for 6 years and absolutely loved them. And when I heard the 20s, in the same system minutes later, they too were wonderful but just a marginal improvement over the 3.x. Yes, the difference was marginal.

In my view, the 3.x Maggies have no competition for the price point unless you need a more dynamic system. Where else can you pay less than $4k for such awesome sound? But once you hit the $10k+ range, such as the series 20, it's a different story. The Soundlabs are in a very different class altogether. The Maggies sound compressed, muffled, minimal bottom octave extension, lacking inner detail in the trebles, etc., etc., compared to the Soundlabs. This is NOT subtle at all. And again, this is coming from a long time Maggie diehard. So why on earth would someone who tweaks his sources, electronics, cables, speakers, etc., to significant levels beyond the off-the-shelf variation, move from the SL's to the Maggies? IMO, Maggies would be a huge step in the wrong direction in virtually every sonic attribute for such a system.

4) Comparing Maggies to other speakers like Avalon, B&W, etc.: Unless you heard these speakers back to back in the same exact system, such comparative comments have little merit. I heard B&W 802's at my home against my Maggie 3.3s and the B&Ws were VERY musical and natural but I prefered the Maggies for their midrange presence. The Thiel 3.6 and 2.3 that I used in my HT system were way too analytical compared to the Maggfie musicality. But I would be very careful to make comments on any Avalon models as my gut feeling tells me they would destroy the Maggies in many of the same sonic attributes as the Soundlabs over the Maggies.

5) The issue of Magnepan not having "home" dealers: I respect this but time and time again, the most impressive systems I have heard have been either at dealers who work from their home or at homes of other audiophiles. The home environment is far more stable from day to day vs. a shop with many rooms with ever-changing gear. And the home environment much more closely resembles what we will experience in our own system. Soundlabs does this and clearly with great success.

John