CAT SL-1 Ultim. Mk2 vs Manley Steel. for CAT JL-2


Hi guys. Can someone tell me which pream would be more appropriate for CAT JL-2 Mk2 power amp? Manley Steelhead or CATs own SL-1 Ultimat Mk2 w/phono? Most important for me is to have the best possible result from Kuzma Stabi Reference turntable through CAT JL-2 Mk2 to Wilson W/P 7 speakers! Cables are Transparent Audio Reference MM.
So phono stage is very important. My budget for preamp is max.$7500.
Thank you.Regards.
schorly
Oops. Brian of EssentialAudio, in my previous post, please excuse the entirely accidental misspelling of your name as "Brain". HA!
Ubglub: I have not heard two different CAT amp models in an A/B comparison. With all the praise of these amps over the years, I finally had to hear what they were all about. Upon first hearing the JL-2 in Brian's system, I knew they were indeed special.

The JL-2 did not have the rich and lush sound that I had been chasing before. What it did have was a see-through and dynamic quality that I was quite unprepared for. In Brian's system, the JL-2 and the Atmasphere MA1's were both incredibly impressive driving the U1s that easily left my 6 year-old Wolcotts far behind. What I really wanted was the sheer emotion of the MA1's AND the attack of the JL-2. Even at this level, there's no "best" as it still comes down to personal preference.

I ultimately went with the CAT because I felt I could more easily get the rich and spatial attributes through other carefully selected components in my system than to ever get what the CAT did like no amp I had heard ... and ... I tried many amps with the Magnepan 3.3/3.5 speakers.

So why the JL-3? ..... and why the Signature model? First of all, I have to tell you that in my current system setup, and the forseeable future, the JL-2 would get me very very close to what I have with the JL-3 sigs. But I was ultimately too stubborn to get anything but mono amps for a number of reasons: amps near the speakers, shorter speaker cables (I already use long ICs around the room to the amps), more channel separation, more headroom, etc. I needed to "just do it" and get an amp that would work with virtually any speaker and not have any afterthoughts as to doing it "right" the first time. Had I not been so hard headed for this, I would have just gone with the JL-2 right then and there. But the $22k for the JL-3 non-sig that Brian had told me about was always in the back of my mind.

I knew I could afford the mono amps but ultimately I would take a hit on upgrading my Magnepans to the A1s or Avalons that I was also eager to hear. None of this gear was available for audition here in Minneapolis. And the Von Schweikert dealer had also gone out of business so I knew I'd have to travel around the midwest to hear these again as well. No other speakers sold at local dealers captured my attention.

Just as I was preparing to drive out of state to hear the Avalons, a pair of the JL-3 Signatures became available. With much correspondence back and forth on these, the temptation was too great to pass it up. It meant the end of moving up to any number of speakers I had my eyes on. Ultimately I did get an older pair of A1s from someone who wanted to scale down to smaller speakers. And in fact he was interested in my Magnepans but I sold those in 1 day to a local buyer. Shipping Magnepans in their flimsy boxes was just too risky to try again.

When the time comes, a purchase of new A1's or one of the others will happen. And with the more efficient newer SL speakers, the JL-2 would even be more suitable. But with the JL-3 Signature amps, I have no concern that I will need to change amps because of a speaker (like the Avalons or MBL) I might prefer over the SLs. These amps can drive virtually anything out there. And that was the whole point of me going with the JL-3's.

I will answer your other question and then I will stop rambling - the disadvantages of the JL-3 monos amps vs. the JL-2 stereo amp. Both models use a triplet (12AU7/12AX7/6922) of small signal tubes but for output, the JL-3 has double the output tubes. And this latter difference not only brings on a maintenance factor but also much more heat. The JL-3's raise my basement room by 4-5 degrees in the first hour and then about 1 degree each hour. So after 3-4 hours, what was 70 degrees is nearly 80! I have to believe 16 6550 tubes in a JL-2 would be much less heat than the 32 tubes in the JL-3's!

And then there is the need for 30A circuits. I remember at Brian's home, powering the JL-2 caused the lights in the room to briefly dim. Powering down/up all other amps we tried that day had no affect on the lights at all. And this issue came home to me the instant I powered up the first JL-3. The 20A breaker tripped the first couple times I turned on an amp. Then all was fine....until I powered on the second amp! Ken Stevens wrote to tell me I needed one 30A circuit and that I had to wait 5 seconds, but not more than 10, before I powered up the 2nd amp. I ultimately put in two 30A circuits - one for each amp, both on the same phase as the 20A circuit driving the sources and phono/line stages.

So did I scare you with the efforts of owning the JL-3s?

Schorly: Sorry for taking over this thread.

John
Very good explanation, John! I am glad you mentioned your story and differences between CAT JL-2 and JL-3 sig. !
Sasa
John, Thanks hugely. That was a very helpful explanation. I'm saving it to my hard drive!

In fairness to the original poster of this thread, I am continuing the discussion of the relative merits of different CAT amps in a new thread. Please check it out.
Thanks,
Bob