VTL MB-450 "Generations"

Wow! That's what's great about A'gon, not just facts and information (which is what I was looking for) but interpretation of the information and advice about what's most important.

So along the way there was: A signature output transformer, Resistor changes, InfiniCaps, B+ Fuse change, Soft start modules, Super Balanced input circuit.

I talked to a dealer today about the newest versions to be released soon and he did mention the auto-bias circuit (which I can live without) along with the new cosmetics (that I happen to like).

I will drop Bea a line to see if she can put the upgrades together with a serial number.

Thanks Albert & Zaikesman for your informative posts, it's exactly the info I was looking for.

I agree that the new faceplate design, assuming it's similar to the new ST-150S, certainly looks nice with the glass and curved lines, but personally I wouldn't trade the utilitarian handles of the old faceplate -- these amps are heavy. What I didn't realize is that (provided your dealer is correct) the newest versions of the Signature amps will automatically adjust bias...

Albert wrote: "I'm pretty sure the cap upgrade path removes the MIT's and replaces them with Infinicaps." The Sig amps like mine, with no cap upgrades, had VTL-branded caps, made I believe by Reliable but not as premium as their Multi's or MIT's. This can be confusing, because there are several different kinds/grades of MultiCaps, and VTL never specified which one they used, claiming they were proprietary. They do the same thing now with their TRT InfiniCaps. It's something I asked Peter Moncrieff at TRT about, but he didn't or wouldn't answer on that topic. I wound up buying his DynamiCaps instead anyway, which he indicates have a slightly more euphonically tailored sound, whereas the Infini's are supposed to be more "direct". I sort of made my choice based on complementing the swap to my preferred EH KT88 output tubes, and also Michael Percy's advice.

So - if needed - what kind of a job is it to replace the caps? I'm decent with a soldering iron but I've mostly upgraded old tube guitar amps, not something with this level of build quality. I had thought of rolling to KT88's on next tube swap myself, what kinds of changes do you hear?

I agree handles are nice but I would give them up for that faceplate (just have to get help putting them in place!) It also sounds like the auto-bias will come at a cost. Thanks for the details on the caps. -Bruce

Hi Bruce: You've done more on your own with your old tube guitar amps than I've done myself with mine. The VTL circuit board seems pretty spacious and easy to access as far as modern hi-fi tube amps go. This is a job that I personally want to enlist a tech with skills and knowledge I don't have for, but you may be able to take care of it yourself. In either case, the cost should be far lower than what VTL wants, not even figuring in shipping. Just don't expect to get any help or advice (including parts or schematics) from VTL under any circumstances other than sending your amps to their factory, regardless of whether you buy new and are in warranty (in which case you'd be told to go through your dealer) or whether you buy used with no warranty expectations and are willing to pay.

My experiences with tube swaps are detailed on Albert Porter's system thread and some other archived threads, in addition to the experiences of others, so there's plenty to read on that around here. I haven't tried everything, but I can tell you that it's not just a 6550 vs. KT88 question; different brands of each sound different from each other.

I checked with VTL today and they never put infinicaps in the stnadard MB-450's. The only do it as a special mod. The standard is the MIT Multicaps.

The infinicap upgrade is $1,200 for both amps. I am going to have it done when they are less busy. Right now the wait time is 3 to 4 months.