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The Emotiva Challenge

A few days ago I posted a review of the Emotiva amps after testing a XPA-3 and XPA-2 that my friend had recently bought. I was so impressed that I ordered a XPA-3 for my own home theater and then spent more time evaluating the amp against some other gear

Okay.....here's my continued review of the Emotiva XPA-3 amp......I call it a challenge, but that's a tad dramatic!

Associated gear for use and comparison, some of which is not mine......!

Def Tech BP7004 speakers
Paradigm Studio 20 version4 on Skyland 4 post stands
Rogue Metis preamp-stock tubes
Denon AVR series receiver (standing in as a processor for home theater)
Oppo CD player with upgraded output and a few other mods I can't remember
Sony 360 and Playstation III for Blu-ray playback
SVS PC 16-46 sub (the big water cooler!)
MJ Acoustics 150 MKII sub (10 inch sub that bests REL in the same range)

Gear I had on hand for comparison:

Odyssey Stratos red board version with upgraded caps....1700 dollar amp
Rotel 1090
Manley Stingray II....the latest version of this well respect design costing 3K, but thank god for the remote!

So now the XPA from Emotiva has been running for quite a while. Perhaps it's not fully broken in yet, but then neither is the Manley Stingray.

For Home Theater Use
The XPA-3 let it's power be felt 100% of the time. It produced insane volumes in my large theater room. Surprisingly it also created sensational bass that my other amps did not manage. I AM AT A LOSS AS TO WHY. All 3 front speakers have powered subs, so all other things being equal it would seem that the XPA is sending out bass content that the Rotel & Odyssey are not. In virtually every respect the XPA sounded every bit as good as the Rotel and Odyssey (which only drove two channels for the comparison). But the XPA was simply more fun for it's huge bass display. With the Paradigms driven full range this effect was also apparent. As a home theater amp the XPA seems faultless and if you have a dedicated theater a far more expensive Rotel or Wyred for Sound or Parasound is just going to leave you with less money for your music system.

For Music
Okay, this is where it gets a bit upsetting, since I had spent a lot on some SS amps previously! The Rogue Metis pre is a reasonably nice tube pre-amp. But it's not super high end. I think it's a reasonably priced unit and might be a "expected" pick for those seeking to get some music in two channel mode out of the Emotiva. The Rotel was darker. Much to my surprise it managed to sound brighter, but space around instruments or "air" was less present compared to the XPA. Imaging from both the XPA and Rotel was rather two dimensional. There was left to right coherency, but little depth. I could almost always tell where the speakers were in the room. But once again the XPA seemed to have bass content that was missing from the Rotel. I ended up adjusting the sub controls, but I still got a superior bass presentation from the XPA. Next up was the Odyssey and this was a clear step up in one important respect: Image depth. Now I could not as easily hear the "box effect" and the speakers were harder to locate. Next up was the expensive Manley Stingray II. This integrated amp has less than around 70-80 hours on it, so it's still breaking in. In 18 watt triode mode, with a 30 minute warm-up, the Stingray made the Def Techs and Paradigms vanish. Voices sounded "in the room" and David Bowie's Andy Warhol sounded more life than any of the solid state amps could manage. The Stingray seemed to even catch the room tone on various recordings and easily gave a sense of space around many instruments. In short...18 watts of triode stomped on the big amps big time. I also used the Denon as a pre and got mediocre results with the XPA, which now sounded somewhat dull. It's clear that a good pre is important if you plan to use the XPA for music. That leaves out processors on the whole. The Denon/Rotel combo was more musical in this case and this simply proves that you should only judge a component with YOUR gear in YOUR room in the final analysis.

Summary
The pre-amp and other associated gear will make big differences of course. But I've been listening to a lot of amps in recent months as I upgrade my theater and dedicated music system. I've passed on Wyred for Sound, Rotel, Parasound Halo (which I really like), Outlaw and a few others. I sold my Odyssey, but have a borrowed one which I may buy for another room.
For home theater the XPA is nothing less than amazingly good and I'm not basing that on price. I just spend a lot of cash on 18 watts, so I'm not basing my purchases on "value." If the XPA underperformed it would be sent back and I'd happily pay for a Bryston again. For music this becomes more complicated. I think the Odyssey is more musical than the other SS amps above and there is a great 3 channel version available. That may be the best value if you plan to use your theater setup for music a lot.
ALL of this gear sounds good and good matching can elevate any amp above another these days. High end technology is now commonly found in low cost gear and today's mid-fi is yesterday's high end. If you must consider cost per watt, then the Emotiva amps are the best I've ever heard. It's easily able to keep pace with gear costing 3 times more and may even be better than many for home theater applications.

I am one of "THOSE PEOPLE" who enjoys spending a silly amount of money at times on audio gear. Most human beings consider my purchase of Merlin TSM-XMr speakers extravagant. Some might call them a bargain, but that's a small group! Over the years I've come to realize that the high end is often more about price and individuality. We often express ourselves through researching and finally owning a product which we consider rarefied. Unfortunately in most cases the owners get gear that's not truly superior or they lack the know-how to extract what superior aspects may be present. It's a tricky hobby that is often a difficult balance between perception and performance, with the winds of ego ever threatening to tip the whole affair over. And with that in mind there are people who will dismiss fine efforts from Emotiva, and other companies like them, out of hand. I did the same thing when I first heard of Outlaw and later I smartened up and bought some of their gear. In some sort of bazaar way it seems that the Emotiva does not belong in the same room as the Manley tube amp. But pushing it's cost out of my head and focusing on it's performance for the task at hand I slowly realize that it is just as high end as the Manley. My suggestion to anyone interested in fine audio, either for music or home theater, is to audition amps like these whenever possible and with a wide variety of associated gear. I heard a Wyred for Sound amp sound dreary with a expensive Cary pre and sound lively and musical with a Parasound pre costing far less. Forget cost. Focus on system synergy and keep an open mind!

Bottom line: The XPA-3 is a winner and I plan to add their XPA-2 to my theater next!

You can few my theater room at this link....
http://ghostlight.zenfolio.com/img/v4/p347770642-4.jpg

Thanks for reading...

Rob
robbob
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isanchez
276 posts
 
Day Glow,
Can you perhaps point out to a link of your reliable sources? Since you seem to follow Emotiva so closely and have done a lot of reading about Emotiva gear, I think we are all very curious about your irrefutable sources.

Can you also tell us how you can say for sure that X amp is better than Emotiva? This is considering the fact, as stated by you, that you have never listened to any Emotiva gear.
dayglow
708 posts
 
Isanchez-If your so curious about Emotiva buy the amp! My opinion regarding Emotiva was made a long time ago. If circumstantial evidence is enough to send a man to prison, it's enough to avoid wasting time on a poorly made and designed amplifier!
dave_72
1,399 posts
 
haha good one!
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isanchez
276 posts
 
Glow,
Can you explain in technical terms how the Emotiva amps are poorly designed? Judging from your posts, it seems you have a Phd in Electrical Engineering. This is not my major, but I'm sure I can follow.

Also, can you explain what constitute a good amp design? Perhaps you can share which amp you own so we know which one is the best.

Please don't be afraid about getting technical with your answers.
2out2sea
72 posts
 
I generally read these threads with a chuckle, but I think I can add some real world experience to the discussion. I replaced a B&K ex442 about a year ago with an Emotiva XPA2. I was trying to find something to match to newly purchased Gallo Ref3.5 speakers. I bought the amp on a fluke. Emotiva is only an hour from my house so I made the trip up there for their big annual bash. I was able to pick up the newest generation XPA2 for a bit less than retail. Not to mention part of the proceeds went to a worthy cause, but I digress.

The B&K was dual mono and 200w/ ch. The Emotiva 300w/ch. I had researched the B&K years ago when I first got into the audio hobby because I had couldn't stand the Adcom 5400 that I initially purchased. It was too bright and the B&K was recommended to tame things a bit. It did. I enjoyed that B&K for more than a dozen years.

There was a big difference in sound when I inserted the XPA2. The Emotiva was like lifting a veil off of the speakers. The difference was truly amazing. Fwiw the B&K is around 400 used and the XPA2 can be had for about 5-600.00 used. Basically apples to apples in my book.

Now, here's where things go a little south. The Emotiva reminds me very much of a Krell. Please don't question me on which Krell. I listened 10 years ago to three different Krell amps pushing through three different Martin Logan Speakers at a store that no longer exists. My experience was that the Krell was hyper-detailed. Everything was slightly exaggerated. The Emotiva had the same effect. I was hearing details I'd never heard from my CD's. But, it was just somehow unnatural.

I have decided that there are some who genuinely prefer the hyper sound. I believe that some manufacturers voice their amps to satisfy this group of listeners. It's just fatiguing to me. Initially I was super excited by what I was hearing, but for critical listening it became bright to my ears. I find I prefer the sound of the triode tube amps that I'm now using. But, that is my preference. It is not a criticism of the XPA2. The Emotiva seemed to offer a similar sound to what I remember from the Krells and to my untrained ear, was superior to the Adcoms, B&K and Parasound equipment that I had experience with over the years.

Compared to the old Adcom and B&K gear the Emotiva was much better. It had much better control with tighter less wooly bass than the B&K and presented a bigger sound stage with less brightness on the top-end than the Adcom. It also never sounded stressed or closed in. It seemed to have never ending reserves. I even had a chance to a/b the Emotiva to a Jolida 502b, which is an integrated, but tubed and 50% more than the Emotiva. It was a trade-off. If you err on the side of warmth and fatigue-free the Jolida would be the choice b/w the two. If you prefer that hyper detailed, exaggerated sound then the Emotiva gave you more "sound." Of course the Emotiva wins hands down if SPLs are what you're after.

So there you go. I'm a lowly audiophile with limited real world experience. However, I do have direct experience with the amp in question in relation to other similarly priced amplifiers of various vintages.

While I don't have the XPA2 in a system right now, I'm not going to sell it. I plan on using it in another system later. It's a good deal and to my ears swings far above it's price point.
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