Pass Labs:What to expect fm XA60.5 to XA100.5

Pubul57,

I think the XA60.5 should have enough power for Elmerpoh to enjoy his system. I've tried (unsuccessfully I guess) to make three points in this thread.

1) I have always benefitted from more power with my Pass amps. Enough power to drive a given speaker to certain SPL is one thing, for the speaker to sound it's best is often another. For me, the XA160.5 sounds considerably better driving my Mini II's (87dB, 4 ohm) than did my XA100.5. Elmerpoh may prefer the sound of the XA100.5 to the XA60.5 even if it seems like the added power is not needed.

2) Elmerpoh may benefit more from a Pass pre amp with his existing XA60.5 than with the XA100.5 and using his DAC directly for roughly the same money.

3) The only way to be really sure which amp he will prefer is to listen to the X350.5 and the XA100.5 in his own system if this is possible. The dealer may not allow this. It is unclear.

I have always bought the biggest Class A Pass amp I could afford at the time, and with my speakers, Eggleston and Magico, the sound has benefitted.

I bought a pair of XA160.5's based on a combination of auditioning an XA30.5, advice from Aerial about 20T's power requirements, reading about Peterayer's experience, and this commentary from an email to Pass, which might help a little. You might want to email them about your specific circumstances.

I am very happy with the XA160.5's by the way. You should know that the XA100.5's will heat your room about 50% more than the XA60.5's - I would estimate 1,400 btu/hr for the pair. The extra ~500 btu's are unlikely to matter much if you have ample air conditioning - it's like having two more people sitting in the room.

>>
>> The XA30.5 is very much a good indication of the XA line both for
>> spectral balance and detail. As you move to the larger pieces you get
>> "more" of what the XA-30.5 already is.
>>
>> The exception if there is such a thing would be the XA60.5's. They are
>> more dynamic and powerful as one would expect, but their character is
>> very slighlty warmer than the XA30.5 and XA100.5 at low to moderate
>> listening levels
>>
>> The XA100.5's are very similar in character to the XA30.5 but by virtue
>> of their ability to drive any load we can imagine, pretty much set the
>> standard for dynamic contrast and focus of image.

>> Best
>> Kent English / North American Sales
>> Pass Laboratories
>>

The comment from Pass regarding the characteristic of the XA-60.5 to be warmer than the XA-30.5 at low to moderate listening levels was not true in my system: Silverline Sonata III/Lamm L2 Reference. In fact, the XA-30.5 was warmer than the XA-60.5.

07-14-10: Peterayer
Elmerpoh,

I must have misunderstood you. I thought from your original post that the dealer is getting new stock (both the X350.5 and the XA100.5) in the next 3-4 weeks. I assumed you would simply be able to listen and compare them to your XA60.5 at the shop or better in your system. Now it seems that these will not be available to you to demo/audition in your own system. Is that the purpose of this thread? The dealer will have these for you to purchase, but you will not be able to listen to each ahead of time? That is the only way to really know for yourself.

I agree with Jpspock. The pre amp makes a big difference and the Pass units sound great with the Pass amps. Have you considered getting a preamp and just repairing the XA60.5 instead of upgrading the amp? I would ask Pass or the dealer if this makes more sense.

Peter

1) I have always benefitted from more power with my Pass amps. Enough power to drive a given speaker to certain SPL is one thing, for the speaker to sound it's best is often another. For me, the XA160.5 sounds considerably better driving my Mini II's (87dB, 4 ohm) than did my XA100.5. Elmerpoh may prefer the sound of the XA100.5 to the XA60.5 even if it seems like the added power is not needed.

2) Elmerpoh may benefit more from a Pass pre amp with his existing XA60.5 than with the XA100.5 and using his DAC directly for roughly the same money.

3) The only way to be really sure which amp he will prefer is to listen to the X350.5 and the XA100.5 in his own system if this is possible. The dealer may not allow this. It is unclear.

I have always bought the biggest Class A Pass amp I could afford at the time, and with my speakers, Eggleston and Magico, the sound has benefitted.

Hi Peter,
I am unable to have any head to head hearing of the XA60.5,XA100.5 and X350.5 as my dealer does not allow unsold open boxes.
I do agree that pre amp can makes a some difference of the sound amplified out to the speakers.
Was told there are 2 school of thoughts on pre amp;
1)If I do not have more than 1 source, maybe better to connect the DAC directly to the power amp since the DAC has decent pre amp qualities.
2)Adding a pre amp to give the finishing touch of sound before its being amplified by the power amp to the speakers.

Point 2 actually make me think whether using a decent Tube Pre with the X350.5 makes the sonic qualities compare with the XA.5 series(especially lush/bodied/liquid mids and highs).

I agree with the point 1 & 2 you made. Does agree that 120w @ 4ohms is sufficient for my speakers in my room, just trying to establish whehther what improvement I can expect by going from XA60.5 to XA100.5 with all else being unchange.
Point 3 is something which I am trying to get views from someone which has heard them before since i am unable to do.

So far I can gather the following choice given unable to hear them side by side:

1) Get a replacement set or repair the XA60.5(which i am not happy with the bottom end sonics), maybe add a pre to the XA60.5 to seek better sonics on the lows.
2)Swap for the X350.5 and match with a decent tube preamp to touch up the mids/highs.
3)Swap the XA60.5 with XA100.5 and get a Pass pre amp at later stage.

Cheers

A couple thought to consider, since you have a few weeks before you need to make a decision.

If the amps are brand new, they're maybe still breaking in. The sound will be a little more vivid after they are fully broken in. Make sure they ARE broken in ASAP so you're really hearing them properly.

Also, your speaker/listening positions, dacron stuffing, etc. are still probably what you found worked best with your prior amp. You might be able to get what you want for free just by going through that process again.

In the same vein, try a few other cables if you can during the next couple weeks, since it sounds like you're already pretty close to what you want, and you might feel compelled to do this anyway once you've got the amplifier thing settled.