USB to DAC questions

First USB is ubiquitous. Meaning that it is friggin everywhere on everything. Billions of USB ports and devices out there. Obviously implementation is a concern but at the end of the day it either works or it doesn't work.

When you start to think about all this, you need to get your head around this idea of a world market that is all based on standards - no one can sell crap that doesn't work... and outsourcing and out assembly is the name of the game - not just for price but for speed and flexibility and shipping considerations...

As far as why people develop for a Mac it is most likely not because of the USB implementation. Developing for Mac means walking on about 95% of the market. Unless the application is so specialized that the customer is going to buy a computer just to run it.

Much more likely that the Mac OS offers other benefits as a platform, certain APIs etc. You need to take that kind of stuff with a big grain of salt - the Blue Side is filled with misinformation and urban myths.

Don't know about hi and lo quality ports. There are two standards USB1.1 and USB2.0 Difference is in bandwidth and rate. For audio 1.1 is fine

The other difference I am aware of is that not all USB ports have sufficient power for all units. For instance the Mac keyboard has USB ports but they won't run everything - you get a warning and then you move back to the tower.

Hard to say if Leopard will deliver better audio then Tiger. You'll do just fine with Tiger.

From what I have read, though it handles the drivers differently, Vista is not a particular improvement on XP in the audio space. But its all what you're used to - and what else you want to do with the machine.

Audio playback doesn't take much computational power, lots of people use their oldest machine as a music server and save the horsepower for where they need it.

GMood- Hmm, tough choice b/w the two then. Thanks for the info.

Ckorody- I went and checked my source about what the developer of that camera mod said about PC USB vs Mac USB. Here is an excerpt:

"To elaborate on the PC support issues in the past, our current Andromeda system for the DVX works over USB2.0. This is one of the main reasons why we could bring this system to market for such a low cost. The main 'PC' problem with USB2.0 however, is that there is no minimum required data bandwidth to be supported by USB2.0 hardware manufacturers(the 480Mbps number is just marketing).

Apple machines(with a few older exceptions) have a fast enough USB2.0 bus to support Andromeda. PC's, on the other hand, have all sorts of varying performance and the only way to find out if a system performs fast enough is to test it. It then becomes a significant problem if we need to test even a few of the hundreds(and ever-changing) PC models out there for compatibility."

But, of course, this is just one person and one subjective opinion. Also, this is in reguards to uncompressed video... which needs a much fatter pipeline as the datastream is much larger. With audio, even if there is more "varying performance" on a PC, it may not be an issue as having the maximum data potential may not be as crucial. But, you know, I'm sort of just shootin' fish in a barrel here.

Also, this application is so specialized that someone would buy a computer to run it.

I'm thinking I might try a used mac whether the USBs are superior or not... partly because I am entertaining the idea of picking up the camera mod being described in the quote... partly because people seem to really like the audio quality on them... partly because they are cheap on Ebay... and partly because I have never used one and it could be fun to try :).

If I upgraded to leopard from tiger, what is the install process like for a Mac OS. I know and have done many windows installs from scratch... is it the same process? Or is it like trying to understand another language completely...

Ok, I have another question too... this is shifting gears quite a bit, but here we go. After the Dac, I will only have about $400 to spend on an amp. Do you think my best move would be to buy an integrated or go with just a power amp?

Just running a power amp raises a few concerns for me. First and foremost, it seems kind of dangerous, doesn't it? I mean, if you have a sudden system error and the OS plays an 'error' sound... it could come through your speakers at full power and damage... something... right? Another concern is not having any other hookups to run a DVD player or something into the amp. Also, I heard if you lower the volume on digital audio, the resolution it's self is decreased, is this true? That would mean that if I used a laptop not at full volume, I would get sub-quality sound from what I could when all the way turned up, right?

Man, a lot to know with this stuff. I appreciate all the help guys.

Cheers-

Another Paradisea+ owner here. I do not have the USB version however. Currently just have it connected to the CD player via coax. Leaning towards the Trends UD-10 with the battery pack for connecting to the computer.

An Acer running Windows Vista. Vista improves on XP, and all older versions of Windows, by eliminating k-mixer which was what all the driver workarounds focussed on. Basically Vista is just XP without the extra hassle audio-wise. I've been using Vista since July without any complaints. If you can go Mac do it. I'd also go I2S, but the solutions here tend to be very expensive for what you get.

Some more expensive DACs including the USB Benchmark use I2S eliminating the need for an external connector. BTW the Paradisea is preferred to my $1k NuForce processor. I am using the Bendix tube and a tube damper rather than the cheap stock tube. It's also worth noting that the consensus view is that the Benchmark is very good but somewhat analytical, some people prefer the Lavry DA-10 or Monarchy NM-24. Also, you mentioned the SN DACs as well, just didn't make the cut for me, but the price is pretty good.

Trying to record uncompressed video is a big drive problem and USB - while cheap and ubiquitous - is not fast enough to support it. There is nothing more I/O intensive then video.

Not to razz your buddy but a quick Google suggests that the camera is not ready for prime time... Clever idea, funky, buggy software says one review.

Install - and everything else on a Mac - is very straightforward. Tiger was nasty so make sure you buy a unit with a Tiger OS installed. Most of the hassle is upgrading software to take advantage of each new OS. This consists of clicking Download, the Install. Unless its Adobe stuff and you need passwords. I think you will find pretty much everything about a Mac easier and more intuitive.

As far as next moves. Free advice - you get what you pay for - bag the Andromeda no matter how deep the discount.

Better IMHO to do less better... You can run DAC to power amp and control it from the computer just fine. It's not the system sounds that get you - its the stupid stuff from the Internet that comes torching in when you click on a site that has some Flash into that gets you.

No discussion about speakers here...

Yeah, do an integrated - chances are you can get one for the same money - take a look at the Chinese stuff - a lot of bang for the buck. Or do something in a gainclone or even a Trends package of USB DAC and amp trendsaudio dot com

So dude you have done an awesome job thinking this through. You are done. Go do and have fun

Musicman... I'm not sure what I2S is... I mean, its a protocol of some sort I gather... but what medium is it carried across, etc..?

It's good to hear you like the paradisea. Ya, I heard a couple not-so-appealing things about SN DACs... and they would actually be basically just as or more expensive than the paradisea anyway. Thx for the info.

Ckorody - Ya, I know what you mean about the andromeda. I dismissed it for a long time... now just recently I started to look at it again. Your probably right though, I will probably stay away. It is appealing though... the results people get out of it when it does work look amazing. He's in the middle of making a new system that uses a firewire connection.. that should be much better.

Ya, I know I've researched like crazy at this point... I always do this. I feel I'm nearing an end.

I'm not sure what you meant by "Better IMHO to do less better"... meaning just use amp and no integrated or were you referring still to not getting the andromeda... hmm, im guessing the latter b/c then you recommend just picking up an integrated...?

Not sure what you meant about 'No discussion about speakers here...' either...

Anywho, ya an integrated was what I was leaning towards too. Then I can hook up an el cheapo DVD player and what not as well if need be. I know that there are so many times when somehow my PC audio was turned all the way up... that would be a total bummer to have that happen on my new system... on small speakers, nonetheless.

Would a Trends USB DAC be comparible to a paradisea?

I saw those chinese amps on Ebay... they are like 12 dollars plus 200 for shipping. They looked nice, but I couldn't find any reviews on them anywhere. They are pretty good though? I wonder how they would compare to NAD stuff...

Here is what I have landed on at this point:

Ibook -> USB cable -> Paradisia+ -> Monster 1000i RCA interconnects -> Nad 325Bee integrated -> Monster Z2 reference speaker cable -> 2 Paradigm Atoms v5.

What u think?

I just found a used paradisia for sale... It's about 6 months old but this is the second owner... think I should stay away? He said its in great shape... has about 600 hrs on it... and is including like 5 tubes... "NOS 1954 WE396A, NOS 1950s Tungsol 2C51, NOS Bendix JAN CEA 2C51, NOS GE JAN 5670W and GE 5670 stock tube".

I know I'm full of questions... I just dont want to pull the trigger on anything and feel like I should have done something else all of a sudden.