life without audio dealers

there is a difference between infoirm and recommend.

the inform is like the "what". it tells the reader what the product is doing in a stereo system. what is the relevance of then adding : "i like what the product is doing". a reader can make his own decision if he is told how a product performs.

it is like the expression "you report, i'll decide".

with information, a decision can be made. the indication of preference does not inform, rather it persuades.

i would rather have the reader make up his mind than try to influence him/her. read my reviews and tell me what you think. you can read them at audiophilia.com .

the most important function of a dealer is making the product available for sale. it would seem that this should be sufficient for the educated consumer. also provide an opportunity for home audition. a dealer needs to have one demo of each product he carries. withn such a model, i can see the viability of dealers.

Mrtennis, if the audiophile world were to devolve into small manufacturers directly marketing their products, then how many electrostatic speakers do you think would be on the market? Small may be beautiful but it's not particularly economically efficient nor do truly small companies spend much on R&D. The end result could be higher prices for less innovative products.

The music business may offer insight into what you propose. The major record labels have basically withdrawn from new artist development which leaves new bands with the problem of how to get their music heard. The internet, constant touring, OST or TV placements, video games, etc. are all being used. But from the consumers' POV how does one shift through all the media for something they would like? The record labels once served as a filter for getting the best, well at least the best commercially viable, music to the public. The audio dealer also serves such a function. In a world with hundreds of audio manufacturers it's a valuable function.

Many already do experience "life without audio dealers" - it would appear that the vast majority of people on A-gon recount how they do not have access to a good dealer, either due to geographic location, or lack of quality in the dealers that do exist.

I think the majority of us would welcome the opportunity to have a full-service, knowledgeable dealer with whom to develop an ongoing relationship with. If we take the somewhat idealized version of dealers that some recount, this dealer would know us, would know our system and preferences, and would save us time and money by being able to direct our attentions and $$ to the place they would most benefit our quest, even if, occassionally, that place wasn't a place that they profited from.

I don't understand why the industry seems to be retracting its business model instead of modifying it. It seems much harder now to get in-home auditions, to get trade-up policies, to, in some cases, even get a dealer's attention. Pricing, for at least the upper-end, seems to have no boundary, and the dealers are probably more dependent on the large margins than they've ever been.

I used to live in Lawrence, KS, home of Kief's. It's a college town, so they dealt with tire-kickers in spades. Even back then, they had a three-tiered pricing structure. There was full service - advice, home demo, full support, etc. - for a small discount off of retail. There was "partial service" - advice, home demo, 30-days direct support, after which you dealt with the manufacturer directly, for a larger discount off of retail. Then there was mail order - they'd get the unit in, but as they said - if it comes in two halves, you own both halves. This was for a competitive mail order price.

I don't know why some version of this type of tiered model couldn't work for a modern dealer, something that makes the service more explicitly paid for by the customer.

Mrtennis wrote:

"i see no evidence that trial and error without a dealer's assistance is any less effective than getting an opinion from an audio dealer.

"only the consumer can decide his or her preferences. how does one learn? through listening. from a position of ignorance, one listens and then decides that a certain presentation is what he or she likes."

Duke replies:

At least we agree that experience is necessary to deciding what one's preference is. Assuming the person has access to high-end audio dealerships, I maintain that visiting dealers and listening to what they have on display is usually the fastest and most efficient way to gain such experience. It is not as thorough as an in-home audition, but will narrow down the field of contenders for said in-home auditions.

Mrtennis, what do you propose as the alternative way to gain sufficient experience to decide which presentation is preferred?

I like Kthomas's post. I think we could all benefit from the presence of a high end B&M dealer who is capable of providing a service consistent with the needs of his customer and price his service accordingly. I would certainly welcome one. I have always hated buying over the internet unheard products and rarely ever buy anything used.
Unfortunately all of those that have existed in my area went broke some years ago or converted to AV and only support AV type products.

Now what would really be helpful, especially from all of those knowlegable proponents of B&M stores, would be to help assemble a list of such merchants so those of us who appreciate their services can find one. I live in a metropolitan area with a population excess of 1 million and have no shop I can recommend. Saddly, I have to travel over a hundred miles to even find a high end store, let alone one with which I could enjoy a good business relationship, with interesting (to me) product so I'm left with little alternative but to work with the internet, and I hate it!

I suspect that outside of LA, Chicago, Atlanta, and the Tri-State area on the East coast, the list will be veeery short.

Oh well.....