Do posters intend to hurt the feelings of other members?

There are quite a few here (earth) who tend to make absolute statements. "Brand X sux" or "it is stupid to do it that way". Sometimes these are knowledgeable people. But I think they respond this way to make themselves feel good or seem more knowledgeable than they are.

They often couch this sort of behavior in the idea that they are "straight shooters" or they they are "frank" or that they "don't suffer fools". Usually it means that they just don't have any tact or regard for others.

Most of us have let ourselves respond in ways that we shouldn't so I'm not throwing stones. Just saying.

And then there are the trolls. They are here (earth) to disrupt and insult.

In my experience this is a universal problem on earth that is magnified by the internet. Audiogon seems slightly worse than a lot of other sites I frequent. I don't know why. 

I had to step away from Audiogon for a while for this reason (and my tendency to get drawn into the pig wrestling).

Now I try to avoid any threads about contentious subjects altogether.....except for this one.

When I was in the USAF during residency we had a primitive 'email' system but anything you wrote could be seen by everyone in the hospital. All of us residents were very close and all got along quite well but we liked to give each other a hard time in good humor.

I can remember being approached by a number of hospital staff and nurses about how all of us residents seemed to hate each other and were so mean spirited.

We all knew the ribbing was in jest. Its what tied us together during those stressful years (working 90-100 hours per week, sometimes 36 hours without sleep). But it didn't translate that way to others.

Point being, it can be hard to decipher internet communication. Sometimes we take offense when none is intended.

I see the notions of "trigger" words and "micro-aggressions" as indicators that our culture is getting close to its nadir. I'm sure it is further away than I think and likely to be a lot worse than I can imagine. Kind of hope I'm not here to witness it.

This is not just a curmudgeonly rant. I think it has everything to do with the idolatry of the self and the cult of solipsism. If the self is the ultimate entity then it follows that it should brook no insult and that any slight against it is blasphemy. 

It is human nature to feel that each of us is the center of the universe. It used to be that dispelling this myth was the corner stone of raising a child.  Today academia has latched onto this in a big way and formalizes the idea of self importance. When we teach our children that this is true then we do indeed turn them into 'snowflakes'.

When something as tiny as a "micro" aggression is elevated to the level of real or actual aggression and something as simple as a single "trigger" word is seen as an assault the attempt to elevate the self has turned into making the self as fragile and delicate as a snowflake. Ironically, the attempt to elevate the self has weakened it to the point of uselessness and ultimate weakness.

The result is that such delicate egos have to make the world safe for themselves by suppressing the free flow of speech and ideas. Also an irony since those are inevitably the tools of tyranny which a population of snowflakes will be ill equipped to resist.

@whart  I agree. No single term, moniker or stereotype is sufficient to characterize an individual much less a generation.

But that does not mean that there aren't trends and characteristics among generations that shape the cultures they live in.

I would also say that your sample group, post graduate students, is a small sample and pretty much selected for successful and hard working types.

The truth is that 'micro-aggressions" and "trigger words" are first world luxuries........if not neuroses. 

Neurosis is always a substitute for legitimate suffering.

Carl Jung

I think Audigon needs more moderator attention as well but I think there has to be an expectation by the owners of the site that it will be civil and cordial.

I also think the moderators would need to pay close attention to context. This takes a lot of work on their part but I have had several posts deleted when the content was obviously intended to be humorous and on one occasion it was a Monty Python quote.

The moderator involvement would need to be more interactive as well. In other words, not just deleting posts without explanation. They would need to guide discussion when necessary, delete posts when necessary, suspend or remove offenders when necessary.

@whart I agree about forums having a culture. That's why I mentioned that I believe that culture has to come from the top. That's the owner and the owner's moderating staff.

I have also been a moderator for a very large photography web site. The owners had a primary goal from the outset that it would be a friendly, helpful site. They had many moderators, all of us volunteers, and we clearly understood what their goals were. This created a culture of friendliness and civility that has been ongoing for nearly 20 years now.

Yes, it is a lot of work.

I also participate in a tractor oriented web site that is the nicest most helpful website, not to mention the most useful website on the widest array of topics I've ever been to. It seems to be self moderated for the most part.

On both of these sites trolls pop up but they never stay....or they get the boot.

Luminous Landscape is another photography website that is friendly and helpful. It is a smaller volume site and it is a paid membership. The level of discussion is high. The level of contention and in-civility is near zero and all topics are allowed.

Audiogon is tainted by a small number of members who seem to delight in contention and belittling others. The rest seem very helpful and even the nicest among the helpful folks often get drawn into the bickering of the resident trolls, usually on the same topics. I do too sometimes, but less often  now.

@elizabeth if the reason people come here is for the arguments and incivility then you are correct.

I'd like to think they come to discuss hi-fi and music. Maybe I'm wrong.

Kind of reminds me of the Monty Python skit where people come pay to have an argument. If that's what Audiogon is....well....just as stupid as that skit....but without the humor.

Nothing like meanness and disrespect to draw in the members of a website essentially dedicated to music. 

For my part, I wouldn't miss it and don't miss it on other sites where it does not exist.

Not claiming sainthood here either. I'm quick to be snarky and slow to turn the other cheek. Here anyway. On sites where I know it is not part of the site culture I keep it in check much better.

When I found that I was wasting my existence with FaceBook I walked away. Deactivated the account. Will never go back.

I deactivated my Audiogon account recently too. Was gone maybe a month. Got tired of the nasty responses and my nasty responses in return. When asked why I was leaving I wrote "toxic forum environment".

Is it really that bad here? No, not compared to the majority of other places people interact on the internet. But why does an audio site need nastiness to keep us coming back? It is everywhere else. Why come here for more.

Anyway, in an attempt not to be a snowflake I decided to come back, to try to change what I can about ME and how I respond without expecting anyone else to change FOR me.

And to avoid discussions that have nothing to do with music/audio. 

Still a work in progress. C- at this point.

@whart : "On discourse and what you like or don't--Make it better. That's all you can do"

Amen to that.