JC3+ With Kleos SL?

Thanks Folks,

I think I am going to go with the SL. The JC3+ and the CP-500 it is connected to are both quiet. The Classe CP-500 has input level adjustments so I can even the levels of the connected sources.

daveyf, I believe the only way to drive a high quality phono pre into distortion is to overdrive it on the input side.

Much appreciate the responses,
Robert

I had not made up my mind at the time of the original post.

Interesting you got distortion.  The gain of the phono stage is fixed so I would expect noise but not distortion.  A low input will give a lower output.  One's preamp may distort trying to make up the difference.  That is unlikely with the CP-500, particularly at the reasonable levels at which I listen.  Will give that issue some more thought.

Thanks for the replies,
Robert

Good points lewm.

Lyra is using 5 cm/sec as stated here:
http://lyraanalog.com/kleos-sl.html

And again they mention rigid bearings.

Thanks,
Robert

So let me quote Lyra and then I have a question.  They say, "Most users (and phono stages) will benefit from the regular Kleos with much higher output and considerably more energy; resulting in a much better signal-to-noise ratio."  

The energy part is interesting.  Are the lower output carts less dynamic?  The fact that they say higher output and more output in reference to the regular Kleos begs the question.

Enjoying the discussion:-)

I think they are just being safe and don’t want folks unhappy and trying to return a handbuilt $4k cartridge. Not sure I mentioned it but they did say my setup should work fine. I do have other phono pres, including a tubed one with gobs of gain that I can use if necessary. I think my old PS Audio GCPH has switchable gain.

Called Lyra with a card number, they sent the RMA info so now I need to box it up and ship it.

Take it EZ,
Robert

Interesting.  

I said I had not made up my mind in advanced.  If most replies had said the JC3+ would not be suitable with the SL then I would have saved the money and just had the Kleos checked and rebuilt if necessary.  Based on the data and thinking in this thread,  I doubt my setup will have any problem with the SL and as I have stated, I have other phono pres that would suffice.

Some Humans have trouble admitting that their line of reasoning may be faulty.

Y'all hang in there,
Robert

Hey,

Well I sent the Kleos back to upgrade to the SL and am waiting.

The JC3+ works very well with the Kleos.  My only minor complaint is that it may be a touch forward compared to the other phono stages I have had in the system.  It does have depth to the soundstage so the slight forwardness may be due to the lack of coloration or the way many recordings are produced.  The clarity and extended response allows one to easily hear cable differences.  Also,  the build quality of my unit is very good. 

Hope that helps,
Robert

You are most welcome.

And yeah,  the reviews have been all good.  I am betting the JC3+ is still the one to beat anywhere near it's price.

And on the original topic,  my Kleos SL is on it's way from Japan to Audioquest and may ship to me by the end of the week.

WooHoo!

My backup system of a Dynevector 20xH on a VPI Scoutmaster is pretty good but can't match the detail and fullness of the Kleos/SME 309/SOTA Star (vacuum) combo.  And the elliptical stylus on the Dynevector picks up more noise.

Again let me remind folks that the newer Lyras are different from the older Helikon, etc.  They reproduce more body of an instrument without giving up detail.


Y'all take care
Robert

Hello Again,

To answer my original question,  the Kleos SL works very nicely into the JC3+.  Now on to the sound:

So I have the Kleos SL installed and roughly setup. I say roughly because the Shure stylus gauge is not good for two decimal places and I eyeballed the azimuth and VTA. The horizontal tracking angle did not change as the SL is the same body as the standard version, but I did check it.

As you might suspect, the sound is much the same as the Kleos. It is however more detailed both in transients and overtones. One would probably notice this on acoustic instruments as the plucking or hammer action is more distinct and there is more resonance as well. Also there is more texture which is probably another way of saying the above.

Unlike what an Absolute Sound reviewer said of the SL version of the Etna, the Kleos SL is more dynamic than it’s standard sibling.   Now my main setup is no longer less dynamic that the backup turntable rig. Both macro and micro dynamics have improved with the SL. Everything is more solid. The soundstage is perhaps a bit better and the individual instruments have more air or space around them. If you like the more homogenized sound of moving magnet cartridges, you won’t like the Kleos SL. It is also easier to notice when folks get carried away with reverb and slap echo.

I have a Clearaudio Weight Watcher stylus force gauge on order so I may have more to say after I experiment with different tracking force settings.

Y’all be cool,
Robert

Thanks Joe for your thoughts. 

I was just listening to Birdcage from Sophia Pfister.  That LP is one of Fremer's recommendations.  The acoustic guitar on one of the cuts is quite wonderful,  the "it's in the room" sensation.  Overall the LP, which I believe is AAA, is wonderful on the Kleos SL and as I mentioned,  more dynamic than the Kleos with solid kick drum hits that resonate.

Hope you folks are doing well,
Robert