Tom, if you read my post I was the first to say I didn't think the Audiopoints had ever penetrated my Persian rug and wool pad beneath it. I realize the Audiopoints are most effective when they are coupled to the floor, but if the points couldn't get through my rug...nothing I can do about that. I certainly am not going to change the rug! ItÂ’s a multi-thousand dollar rug and we bought it from an interior design standpoint.
But Robert at StarSound was certain the spikes would work on my carpet/pad and suspended floor and was also adamant that the coupling discs would work on top of the carpet, just not quiet as well as without them. Either way he said I would experience a huge improvement.
And I don't doubt that you experienced exactly what you said you experienced today with the Revels. In contrast, I am telling you what didn't work in my room (for whatever reasons) and what made an amazing difference. Nothing more I can add to that.
Stehno, sorry if I misinterpreted your points. Wasn't intentional.
But I still take exception to this statement:
"Please stop using the concrete slab vs. suspended hardwood flooring systems as it doesn't substantiate your perspective no matter how much you think it may."
No, let me tell you what substantiates my perspective and reduces yours to nonsense. I have been in this room everyday for the last year and a half and you have never set foot in it.
Until you come hear my room and my floor your comment simply smacks of arrogance. Do a search here and at AA. Numerous others have experienced the exact same problem with suspended hardwood floors and in virtually every instance coupling excited the floor more and made the problem worse. The only successful solution for several others before me was the Vibrapod sandwich solution.
You keep talking about the energy getting to ground. THAT'S THE PROBLEM! In my room, the suspended hardwood floor resonates like crazy at certain bass frequencies if my speakers are sitting directly on the floor. You can talk till you are blue in the face. I have lived this scenario every day. I know what has exacerbated the problem and what has cured it.
The point you seem to be missing is that the energy can't get to ground. Don't you get that. Sure some of it will eventually get there, but it has to travel across all of the sub-flooring and floor joists before it finally gets to a point of exit which would be pillars beneath the floor which go to the foundation. By that time the damage is done. The floor has already been vibrating like a drum before the vibrations get to the pillars. No way around that. The energy simply can't jump across all of the floor joists to the pillars.
And your analogy of the lightening rod is excellent. You prove my point. The lightening (airborne vibrations) can't immediately get to ground because there is no direct path in my floor for the lightening to go to ground. It has to go in a convoluted way to find the ground. And again, the damage is already done. I don't understand why you can't grasp that.
Since I can't efficiently get the airborne vibrations and/or the vibrations from my coupled speakers to the ground before they have already have caused a lot of damage, I have chosen to convert them to heat with the Vibrapods. End of story. It works. The bass is fast, articulate, great slam, focus, etc. with the Vibrapod solution. Everything else is dramatically improved, as well. And there is virtually no floor excitation/boom to the point that I have to ask myself if I can even hear any at all.
I find it interesting that some of you guys are prone to tell me and others that what we are experiencing is simply wrong when we are the ones with first-hand experience with our particular situations. It is simply laughable that you are wasting any time at all trying to contradict what I am telling you about my "real world" experience in MY room!
I know what I hear and what I have experienced in my room. And my experience is exactly the same as many others here if you will take the time to do a search.
Stehno, sorry if I seem agitated, but it is frustrating when someone tells me that my own personal experience isn't what in fact it is.
I do appreciate your feedback and everyone else's, as well. But it seems that anytime anyone questions Sistrum products and or their claims around here (or in my case, has actual disappointing results) the gang piles on. That's okay, as I am confident in what I know to be true in my personal experience and I have never been one to be intimidated by the crowd.
The simple truth is I wanted the Audiopoints to work. They are cheap enough and I was hoping to find a starting place for vibration control as I head into upgrading my system next year.
I am a firm believer in tweaking and I am always open to things that work in my system. But if something doesn't work in my system, I am not afraid to say so. I simply try to state how a product performs in MY system. And I never go out of my way to slam or bash a product. I simply say my peace about my experience and move on.
As I said before. I am sure Audiopoints is an excellent product given the right set of circumstances. The circumstances simply weren't right in my situation.
Oops, I almost forgot your last question:
"Are you saying that installing Vibrapods under your transport also eliminated any air-borne vibrations captured by the transport as well?"
Where did you get that? No, I simply said I couldn't feel any vibrations with my hand after installing the Vibrapods. I am sure there are micro-vibrations at work that I can't feel, but what does that have to do with anything. If I had Audiopoints under my transport the same airborne vibrations would be working on my transport and hopefully the Audiopoints would transfer them away to the ground.
Well, my DH Labs cones under all of my components do the same thing, with one exception. (And who knows, maybe the DH cones aren't as effective as Audiopoints after all, but I didn't hear any difference).
The only difference between the Audiopoints concept and my current setup with the DH Labs cones/Formica/Vibrapods is that the Audiopoints work by transferring the vibrations to ground in an appropriate rack system and my DH Labs transfer the same vibrations to the Vibrapods to convert them to heat.
You know a thought just entered my mind. I don't know about your floor, but my floor joists span 14 feet across the room (32 feet long) without any pillars at all beneath them. This is one big drum head. The entire width of the room is open beneath the floor with pillars only on each side of the room. Maybe your room spans only eight feet or so without pillars. Another factor is my floor is a minimum of six feet above the ground progressing to seven feet. I suspect floors that are closer to the ground may not be as prone to the drum effect due to a more limited reverberant cavity. I obviously don't know shit about this stuff, but it makes sense to me.
I purchased screw jacks as a last resort to use with timbers to tighten up my floor in lieu of pillars (which would give the vibrations a more direct path to ground). I thought I would try the Audiopoints first, but I ended up with the Vibrapod solution instead. As good as the results are with the Vibrapods, I have absolutely zero interest or need to address the floor.
Since we built this house a year and a half ago and we will only be in it another two years or so before we build a larger custom home with a dedicated listening room, I don't really want to hassle any more than I have to with the floor. Otherwise, if we were staying in this house long-term, I would have a contractor come out and add additional footings and pillars under the floor.
But one thing is for sure. Our next home is going to have a dedicated listening room on a concrete pad!
