Harbeth Owners - I Need Some Help

I know what're you're saying, Drubin. I try to calculate the physics between a lossy cabinet and rigid, sand filled stand (with flat plate top), or one "Linn style" with an open top like the Epos which is not sand fillable and I just get confused. On the other hand we have Sound Anchor with an open top but pre-filled solid posts. If I could find the Harbeth users website I'd check that out.

By the way, I'm using them in a small (11 x 13 x 8) plaster room and have already used my 9wt 300B Air Tight amp and 100wt SS Muse model 100. The Air Tight, at moderate volumes, produces a far more involving and musical experience; the Muse is rather bland and colorless in comparison. Any suggestions for a more powerful tube or more musical SS "driver".

Harbeth Users Group: http://www.smartgroups.com/groups/harbethspeakers You may find this group to be a bit "un-audiophile" in some respects (cables don't matter, etc.), but it's less hostile than it was just a few weeks ago when a certain well-known reviewer was a daily fixture.

I expect that Dodgealum is correct that the Harbeths are less sensitive to ancillary components than many other speakers. (I don't know if this is an indictment of the speaker or not.) But they still respond, and some people do like them with tubes. As with everything, you will want to experiment. I've only used my Rowland amps with them (so my comment above about sensitivity to other components is based more on intuition than experience), but would love to try something else to see how they respond. Keep us posted.

Dan

Dan--most assuredly not an indictment of the speaker. I think it speaks to the essential musicality of the design. I'm not sure that I would classify any speaker as great (or even acceptable) that only "worked" with the right combination of select cables, amps, etc. For the most part these speakers simply do not "work" -- period. Their owners then spend countless dollars and hours they could be enjoying music trying to find just the right combination of esoteric components to obtain a sound that they convince themselves (for a time) works. I cannot tell you how many speakers I have heard over the past year and a half that simply don't sound "right" and never will regardless of what you put in front of them. I can still remember the moment I first heard the Harbeth's--over five years ago. I knew I was going to buy them after the first minute of the first song I heard. Additional listening was only conducted to satisfy the analytical side of my head. I say better to start with a speakers that gets the essentials right and then build a system around them that complements and enhances their performance. Why do you think so many other "world class" models from long established and esoteric brand names show up regularly on the Audiogon and scaring up a pair of Harbeth's is pretty tough to do? I think their are so few speakers that sound right through the critical midband and therefore people tire of whatever coloration exists that distances them from the music. I don't mean to sound like a Harbeth zealot--I will insert the customary caveat that these impressions are entirely subjective and will admit also that there are a few other good designs out there. However, after a determined effort and countless demos I can say with a high degree of certainty that there are precious few speakers that sound anywhere near as real as the Harbeth's and you will need to spend at least 5K (or more) to own them. They are the best value in audio today for music lovers who do not want to ride the equipment merry go round.

On the subject of stands--I think you can make a good case for open style stands that do not interfere with the intended vibration of the lossy cabinet. Whether you can hear the difference between those and a pair of stands with a fixed top plate I'm not sure. The top and bottom panels of the speakers are the smallest of the lot and therefore probably flex much less than the others and therefore may contribute little to the sound. The Sound Anchors seem to give you the best of all worlds--open top plate but a heavy and rigid anchoring of the speaker. I just happen to think they look like bupkiss.

Your points are well taken, Mark. There is no question that the Harbeth is right and musical in an essential way. As I survey the landscape of our hobby, it is also clear that we get conflicting messages about how desirable this is. I have read many, many enthusiastic speaker reviews that proclaim, as if it’s a good thing, that this or that speaker “will reveal everything upstream and if you don’t have the best ancillary components, you will suffer the consequences.” A reviewer might say, “As a reviewer, these speakers are a great ‘tool’ for me, but if I were ‘just’ a music lover, I might choose something else.” Then they stick it in Class A and audiophiles yearn to own it. I’ll project my own struggles here and suggest that many of us in this hobby want to wear both hats. We don’t want to be denied hearing those differences between upstream components (this is not the J. Gordon Holt definition of transparency, but it is certainly a valid use of the term), but on the other hand, we’d sure like to just enjoy the music.

When I owned ProAc Response 2.5’s, I kept trying to get greater clarity out of them: I *wanted* to better hear what was going on upstream. When a friend loaned me his Thiel 1.6’s, I realized that the ProAcs were obfuscating too much of the playback chain. As much as I loved their musicality, my jones for “the hobby” was being choked. So Thiels it was, and now, two years later, I also have Harbeths in the house. In case it isn’t obvious, this boy clearly doesn’t know WHAT he wants.

I think the speaker you are now leaning towards as your Harbeth replacement will move you a little more in the direction of reviewer’s tool (though not too much). I’ll be curious to see how that goes for you. I expect you’ll find it exciting and exhilarating at first. Later on, you may find you’ve opened Pandora’s box. Then you can join the Church of Audio Angst that tithes so much salary from so many of us. :-)

Dan, I think much of what you say is true--and I will take it as a warning. When folks refer to any component as a good "reviewers tool" it raises in my mind the "great divide" that seems to exist within the community--between those that are into music and those that are into gear. The folks into music see the gear as a means to an ends. For folks into gear the equipment is an ends in itself. What you point up is the degree to which both reside within all of us. Though I consider myself one of the former, I will freely admit that at times a certain obsession with the gear itself begins to crowd out the music lover in me. I try to protect against this because, for the most part, I perceive those who are into the gear as perpetually unsatisfied, in debt and in conflict with their wives (if they have one). As I move forward in my pursuit of speakers to replace the Harbeth's I'm gonna try real hard to find something that retains their musicality but adds deeper bass and better looks. I may never get there but one lives in hope.