Neutral electronics are a farce...


Unless you're a rich recording engineer who record and listen to your own stuff on high end equipment, I doubt anyone can claim their stuff is neutral.  I get the feeling, if I were this guy, I'd be disappointed in the result. May be I'm wrong.
dracule1
I'm only speaking for myself of course but IMO audiophiles tend to over analyze this kind of stuff too much. It's only natural considering the money involved. I've given up the need to over analyze frequencies or any other such stuff to come to a conclusion about my gear. The only thing that maters is what sounds neutral to me.  In the end It may not sound neutral to anyone else. In the search for "neutrality" you can go and blame the electronics, the electricity from the walls, the rotation of the earth for that matter. Your chasing a perfect circle. Meaning it's a concept that cannot truly be achieved. So the only person you have to convince is yourself. None of it amounts to anything unless you like it yourself. All this talk about what is and what isn't neutral is a waist of time IMO - interesting to talk about but ultimately a black hole for your time. We are all trying to achieve a sound the we - individually - like so there can never be one truth about any of this stuff. Just groups of people who cluster together at different points of the spectrum of what they consider correct. We all intuitively know this but I guess we are gluttons for punishment cause we keep going in circles about it. 😜

Neutral is too ill-defined as it applies to audio but it seems to be used frequently and many are not sure what it means. If I was interested in purchasing a particular piece of gear I might for a very brief moment want it to sound neutral, forgetting that the end result of any system is based on the combination of several other components. Someone made that word up, so get rid of it.
Dracule1, I too see no use for the concept of "neutral." I think realism is the goal I seek. One has to know what instruments sound like and hear the human presence around their playing or singing. But recently, I have heard realism at the fringes of the orchestra that are new. The illusion of a three or four person group seems easy but that of a symphonic orchestra or big band is not. I heard it somewhat in the Zandon suite at CES but much more with the new H-Cat X-10 MkIII amp. I no longer will be without this total realism.

Neutral IS attainable...very much so; as a valid audio concept it is alive and well, even if only in a purely subjective sense. But, brightness, darkness or bass-heavy etc, are nothing more than frequency response issues and can be fully corrected as such. What cannot be corrected in that way are the effects of colorations. That is a different problem with a different solution. I’m not talking about just speaker boxes, although that is certainly part of it. What I’m talking about here are the colorations in the components, passive crossovers and the wiring - ALL of the wiring...power cords, IC’s, speaker, all the in-wall wiring, breaker box wiring - everything. Yes, it is about EMI/RFI and yes, it is about magnetic fields. (I happen to think Geoff was in the middle of making a very good and valid point about magnetic fields here originally before he was so shrewdly interrupted ;-)

But, be that as it may, there’s still such a thing as non-neutral gear, pro or audiophile. We’re all probably aware of the nature of, say, the amp market at around, say, $3k or less. ’Rogue’ amp designers trying to make a name for themselves by giving us "more" of some particular favored attribute when we really know that it really can’t happen that way without giving up some other still-desirable attribute in the design process. We know this is true because if they were able to give us more of the good stuff without ever sacrificing anything elsewhere, then everybody would be making amps that way...there would be only one way to go to get the best sound and clearly that’s not the case, is it? There is no free lunch. And then there are, just for example, all those low cost tube amps that are known (and even sought) for their colorations (yielding some ’tonal color’ to a degree and "sweetness")...whether those colorations predominantly belong to the tubes they are using or to their amp design. I don’t really want to take anything away from those folks who prefer going this route, it’s all good and perfectly valid...it’s just not my particular cuppa, but I respect it 100% but, that’s because I know there are so many more buying factors that go into those choices than what I can include here.

My prior amps were the little (but mighty) Monarchy SM-70 Pros (single-ended transistor design). Long on timbre, but short on good string sounds, but overall somewhat colored through the lower mids and to lesser extent up into the midrange. It took a long time for me to fully figure out why I could never get EQ to sound right, no matter how much I experimented, measured or listened. Sometimes it sounded FAR better than I would’ve thought it had a right to - and then suddenly it would sound ’off’ or unnatural on the next disc - or even on the next track. No amount of Alan Maher Designs electrical noise reduction gear could neutralize that. When I ’upgraded’ to the less expensive and pro-sound Crowns I’m using now, Bam - that problem disappeared entirely. EQ now is set it and forget it...no measuring needed.

I suspect, though, that for some audiophiles, there may be perhaps too much of this kind of gear available to sift through and because most audiophiles don’t start out with the experience level to avoid buying this kind of gear initially, manufacturers may interpret this as ’demand’ and may respond by making more. But, there may be a certain frustration level out there by those who are not finding the neutral kind of gear they’re looking for, so they may end up feeling they are forced to go the "natural" sound route, instead. Not necessary, maybe, but IMO understandable possibly, given the lay of the land.

As for solving colorations (the electrical ones, not physical), I was able to solve that with AMD gear...but, my components had to be inherently neutral enough as well.

I define ’neutral’ then as having no colorations, a sound that is equally adept at reproducing "lush", "sweet", "brash" and "shrill". (Also can be used to describe a sound stage that’s neither too far to the front or to far to the rear).


Congrats to Peyton Manning!
(I happen to think Geoff was in the middle of making a very good and valid point about magnetic fields here originally before he was so shrewdly interrupted ;-)
He got interrupted because he didn't understand how magnetic fields worked. This was around the issue of balanced line connections, which can be used to eliminate problems of cable construction and colorations as well as the effects of magnetic fields impinging the cable. BTW, this is not to say that EMI/RFI isn't a problem; Geoff was right about that); what I am saying is the if you run balanced lines and the equipment supports the balanced line standard then the cables will have almost no effect on the sound and it will get around the problem of EMI impinging the cable.