2. tech-talk
  3. 129969-75330

HELP AFTER MY MODS, My tweeters are subdued and weak-

So I have a pair of Mirage M1 speakers, I changed the caps in the crossovers to Jantzen Superior Z (for the tweeters) and standard z for the mids and bass.
 
I also changed the internal cabling to Supra Classic 2.5.

First Impressions-  Not burned in yet
The highs are there but really recessed in the background. Theres a song I reference and it has a steel guitar solo, I can bearly hear it through the vocals because its seems recessed so far back.

SO HERES THE QUESTION- Is that a symptom of unburned in cables and or caps, or is that just what Supra cables give you?

When I changed the internal cabling a few years back on the same model speaker, I used DH LABS t14 Silver plated cable, This had the opposite effect, it was super bright and fast, but it smoothed out and the brightness relaxed, leaving a lot of detail but not so much your ears bled.

But here its the opposite, its dull on the top end and the vocals kind of take over and blur out the top end.

idahifi
erik_squires
5,268 posts
 
Idahifi,

Bring your problem over to DIYhifi, where you will find tons of speaker design geeks in the Multi-Way forum. :)

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/

I can help you there more easily with pics, diagrams etc.

Best,

E
timlub
1,649 posts
 
Hi Idahifi,  The last time that I used the Jantzen Z caps as replacements,  I had the exact same issue.  It took about 40 hours before they came to life.  If it is truly a problem of ESR differences in caps,  that can be measured and compensated for with a resistor.  Really the series resistance shouldn't be great enough unless there are alot of caps paralleled maybe, but if resistance is that far off,  it could even effect the crossover point.  Overall simple cap replacements in a crossover should not be a problem. 
timlub
1,649 posts
 
Just looked at your photo... This can be reversed engineered. 
terry9
931 posts
 
I find that every component has a sonic signature. Film and foil caps are the most neutral, with few exceptions. I find the most neutral of the sanely priced caps to be MIT Multicap styrene film and tin foil.

I haven't used Jantzen caps, so I can't offer specific comment, but I can tell you that every electrolytic you replace has the potential to dramatically change the sound. At first, the sound may appear to be less bright, but that is probably because electrolytics tend to introduce lots and lots of nasty high frequency distortions, which can be confused with brightness. So replacing the electrolytics is simply removing high frequency distortion.

Try some unprocessed female vocals. See which speaker sounds the most like the women in your life. Then live with the sound for a month, and try again. You may be surprised.

idahifi OP
100 posts
 
So this morning I was fortunate to speak with a guy from a Mirage distributor who was quite familar with the M1. He said that the ESR should not be an issue.  He told me to check all the solder joints. So I did and I realized that the joint feeding the "hi" section of the cross over looked suspect I re soldered it and tried the crossover, and low and behold the upper highs have returned to at least be in acceptable parameters, and comparable to the other crossover. 

Despite the tweeters sounding more normal, the sound overall still sounds a smeary, or, maybe choppy, I dont know how to explain it, its not quite smooth yet.
So will the smoothness come with time?  Tim did you find this with yours?

Another thing is I am wondering if I should increase the resistance due to the lower esr caps replacing the old Electrolytics. I dont want to get to far off from the traditional M1 Sound, but I am up to increase the detail and smoothness, which is why I replaced the old caps in the first place.

Enclosed is a schematic, if it may help.  
https://ibb.co/hrQ6oF


What are your thoughts, leave it or add an additional .5 - 1 ohm resistor.

Or if I should just burn it in and if the sound is good, leave it as it is..,,...



More to discover