High End is Dead?


Browsing used audio sites such as Audiogon and the Marts, high end gear ads are dominated by several dealers. Non-dealer ads are usually people trying to push 15+ year old off-brand junk at 60-70% of MSRP (when they were new). They don't sell anything. You could slash Wilsons, Magicos, etc, 50% off retail and no one will buy them.

No one buys if it costs more than 1k. It's not that they're not interested -- the ads get plenty of views. It's that the asking prices are just way over the ability of buyers to pay. Fact is, if you see a high end piece for sale it's probably by a dealer, often times trying to push it at 15% off retail because its a trade in, but also often they are taking a good chunk off the price 30, 40 sometimes 50% off. They can be famous brands with a million positive reviews. No buyers.

Are we just poor, and that's all there is to it? 
madavid0

Hi Guys

I was gone for the last couple of days but was looking forward to reading more on this topic. First, why I was gone was because some of the members here asked me to help them with their "final" system. I find that interesting that they made the point of saying "final" instead of first or another. The Harry & J Gordon audio kids are in our late 50's-80's. The HEA revolving door lost a lot of it's steam, and fun to be honest, because the magazines were keeping us under their spell. When the magazines started loosing that hip generation of reviewers I think many of us began thinking "is the end near". After the mid 90's the industry had a different feel to it, which I mentioned earlier. When I read some of the comments made, the image in my head is the guy driving on threads yet still trying to pump air into those over used tires.

The Kool Cats to me are the guys who have enjoyed this hobby for what it was and what we have explored together with all of the great personalities and products. However we have also grown in wisdom and discernment as listeners. We are the guys who lived through the golden era of HEA. The quest of making it better, was a different one from those with one foot in the polish and the other in the bucks. There are younger Kool Cats out there now, but I don't see them all that interested in HEA. A great sound in their room yes (still having dedicated rooms), but no interest in the same language or chassis. The younger newer guys (and gals) have no desire to go to the HEA shows. Why? Because they have their own shows of advanced audio. I did a system for one of these younger gents just 3 weeks ago and it was killer, only he didn't call it a listening room or a home theatre. The name for this room was "the gaming room". The focus was on sight & sound but no huge amps sitting on display along with their hard to drive speakers. We did a simple Tunable setup, and I have done two of these setups since because of the demo he gave to others.

The hobby has changed, and as great as the listening hobby or movie hobby still are, the gaming hobby has become the latest addiction for the senses. After we built this gaming room/system the owner played a video from "Tool" and I think I left sometime in the early morning, after being turned on the tons of artist through his eyes and ears. He didn't once mention anything HEA, but was totally into the soundstage I had created for him. Things were floating in and out of the room's dimensions, appearing on and off the screen. Sound Stage!

I don't see the new generation debating the meaning of soundstage like highenders do. These folks are all about the electronic soundstage, and either the system can play it or not. HEA is a very hip thing, but it's somewhat weird for us to hang our hat on something that will be archived as a past technology. Yep, there are a few youngsters that are going to keep HEA alive, but compared to the mainstream HEA is a declining species. And, why shouldn't it be? I have to apologize to some of you on here for me being so bold, but if you think newer recordings are crap, you need to literally consider the source. Soundstaging is and always will be advancing. If you have a system that can't play it, that's a different issue than the recording.

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net

+1 Michael

You describe the situation perfectly as age and generational-based. Am in my mid-60s and went to a professional orchestra concert recently. Was the youngest person there by a large margin.

There are few or no young orchestral lovers coming up and wonder if the HEA landscape is similar.

Mind the gap.

Vinyl has made a comeback of sort and will slowly refill the ranks of the HEA. Sort of.  Kinda. In it's own way. But there will be a gap, for a while.

The vynil resurgence may only create a numbers game that is akin to a dead cat bounce.

We won't know until we get there.
Posted this on the " New Tweak---It's Fantastic"  thread.

Other takes from Axpona.
Is High End Dying?  The answer would be, YES!

20-30 year old - Non Existence
30-40 year old - Only in tow with an old guy
40-50 year old- some and only tow with an old guy
50-55 year old - some
55-65 year old - A LOT
65+  My group; I am still hanging in: my friends are passing younger. Those that are left; are passing in front of TV.

My buddy's comment; He has never seen so many old, white, middle class guys in one place.

Yep I believe we were part of the greatest HEA generation, and what fun it was! The camaraderie was genuine. I remember Frank Doris took me over to Harry’s place (early 90’s) and set me loose. The place had all my acoustical treatment and the racks, and custom built ampclamps for this amazing sea of the top ender amps at the time. I was having a blast all by myself until I heard this voice "so your the one" I turned and then went on with my tuning. A few moments later I heard "mind if I do" so he took over the chair, listened, and then said to me "this will never be the same again". Harry understood the era that we all built together. I tuned Harry’s systems up several times after that and each time it was like "this will never be this good again". Harry Pearson’s absolute sound was not a product, it was a moment of listening. Another time I was there set free to do my thing, and especially choose my favorite sound (which is impossible at Harry’s place with so many toys). I was in town for 2 or 3 days and finally landed on the sound I was going for at that time. I got the biggest smile of approval when I chose a small Beard amplifier over so many options and price ranges. You could just see that look on his face "this is the best there ever was".

There was something about that particular time in this hobby where listeners really were giants and equipment listening was more than a 3 day trade show or a test report. Mimic as they might try today but to those of us who lived it, there was a depth and anticipation that you can’t duplicate. Generations of listeners are just that. It’s a moment that isn’t suppose to be kept on life support forever, it was an era that we entered into together, and because we had music as our guide and friendships as our family, we did something great! And most importantly every recording was a treasure to some and a nightmare to others. It was a generation that was a main meal and not leftovers.

Today is new and fresh, and different. And the quality of today is the same as when our elders look at us saying "what is that your playing" because they didn’t understand it. It’s a language of new and our moms and dads look at us wondering how we could listen to such trash. Today that trash is our beloved classics. Each generation brings it’s own into the world. We’re not going to reverse this, it already happened.

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net