High End is Dead?


Browsing used audio sites such as Audiogon and the Marts, high end gear ads are dominated by several dealers. Non-dealer ads are usually people trying to push 15+ year old off-brand junk at 60-70% of MSRP (when they were new). They don't sell anything. You could slash Wilsons, Magicos, etc, 50% off retail and no one will buy them.

No one buys if it costs more than 1k. It's not that they're not interested -- the ads get plenty of views. It's that the asking prices are just way over the ability of buyers to pay. Fact is, if you see a high end piece for sale it's probably by a dealer, often times trying to push it at 15% off retail because its a trade in, but also often they are taking a good chunk off the price 30, 40 sometimes 50% off. They can be famous brands with a million positive reviews. No buyers.

Are we just poor, and that's all there is to it? 
madavid0
A couple of things…many young people attend concerts in droves (actual droves), and not just for electronica, so there’s that. Also, "high end" has always been dead in the sense that the amount of people who "actively listen" to recorded music has always been minuscule, and alleged High End "salons" have no idea how to sell the stuff to anybody but the already interested. Local legends Goodwin’s High End (it’s in the name so it must be good…good…win…high end) doesn’t have a mailing list for events, doesn’t do live music at their shop (a travesty…you can get a great jazz trio to play for less money than the cost of a used cable), and is staffed with both nice people, and self absorbed "experts" with minimal 2 way conversation content absorption skills. "We don’t sell Linn belts (true thing), but here’s a great $5,000 turntable for ya." The good news is that companies like Schiit and Rogue and others prove all night that less precious gear can sound astonishingly good. I run sound for live shows, and attend things when I’m not too lazy to get off the couch, and last weekend saw the Brad Mehldau trio, and the weekend before that saw Yo Yo and the BSO…any reference for my home rig? Hell no…my home rig is tweaked and assembled for me only! Note that Goodwin’s should open a "middle end" and "low end" biz.

Hi Guys

I was gone for the last couple of days but was looking forward to reading more on this topic. First, why I was gone was because some of the members here asked me to help them with their "final" system. I find that interesting that they made the point of saying "final" instead of first or another. The Harry & J Gordon audio kids are in our late 50's-80's. The HEA revolving door lost a lot of it's steam, and fun to be honest, because the magazines were keeping us under their spell. When the magazines started loosing that hip generation of reviewers I think many of us began thinking "is the end near". After the mid 90's the industry had a different feel to it, which I mentioned earlier. When I read some of the comments made, the image in my head is the guy driving on threads yet still trying to pump air into those over used tires.

The Kool Cats to me are the guys who have enjoyed this hobby for what it was and what we have explored together with all of the great personalities and products. However we have also grown in wisdom and discernment as listeners. We are the guys who lived through the golden era of HEA. The quest of making it better, was a different one from those with one foot in the polish and the other in the bucks. There are younger Kool Cats out there now, but I don't see them all that interested in HEA. A great sound in their room yes (still having dedicated rooms), but no interest in the same language or chassis. The younger newer guys (and gals) have no desire to go to the HEA shows. Why? Because they have their own shows of advanced audio. I did a system for one of these younger gents just 3 weeks ago and it was killer, only he didn't call it a listening room or a home theatre. The name for this room was "the gaming room". The focus was on sight & sound but no huge amps sitting on display along with their hard to drive speakers. We did a simple Tunable setup, and I have done two of these setups since because of the demo he gave to others.

The hobby has changed, and as great as the listening hobby or movie hobby still are, the gaming hobby has become the latest addiction for the senses. After we built this gaming room/system the owner played a video from "Tool" and I think I left sometime in the early morning, after being turned on the tons of artist through his eyes and ears. He didn't once mention anything HEA, but was totally into the soundstage I had created for him. Things were floating in and out of the room's dimensions, appearing on and off the screen. Sound Stage!

I don't see the new generation debating the meaning of soundstage like highenders do. These folks are all about the electronic soundstage, and either the system can play it or not. HEA is a very hip thing, but it's somewhat weird for us to hang our hat on something that will be archived as a past technology. Yep, there are a few youngsters that are going to keep HEA alive, but compared to the mainstream HEA is a declining species. And, why shouldn't it be? I have to apologize to some of you on here for me being so bold, but if you think newer recordings are crap, you need to literally consider the source. Soundstaging is and always will be advancing. If you have a system that can't play it, that's a different issue than the recording.

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net

+1 Michael

You describe the situation perfectly as age and generational-based. Am in my mid-60s and went to a professional orchestra concert recently. Was the youngest person there by a large margin.

There are few or no young orchestral lovers coming up and wonder if the HEA landscape is similar.

Mind the gap.

Vinyl has made a comeback of sort and will slowly refill the ranks of the HEA. Sort of.  Kinda. In it's own way. But there will be a gap, for a while.

The vynil resurgence may only create a numbers game that is akin to a dead cat bounce.

We won't know until we get there.
Posted this on the " New Tweak---It's Fantastic"  thread.

Other takes from Axpona.
Is High End Dying?  The answer would be, YES!

20-30 year old - Non Existence
30-40 year old - Only in tow with an old guy
40-50 year old- some and only tow with an old guy
50-55 year old - some
55-65 year old - A LOT
65+  My group; I am still hanging in: my friends are passing younger. Those that are left; are passing in front of TV.

My buddy's comment; He has never seen so many old, white, middle class guys in one place.