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Counterfeit DL103?

I decided to finally see what all the DL103 fuss was about and try one in my office system. Bought one on USAM that was admittedly priced surprisingly low but I snagged it very soon after it went up and the photos showed a cart that looked exactly like every DL103 I've ever seen including the identifying sticker with serial number. So I figured the gods had smiled on me and left it at that.

When I finally got around to mounting it, I ran it through my Allnic AUT2000 step up tranny which I brought into the office from my home system while I'm waiting on some replacement tubes. Into the Allnic and then the MM stage of my Marantz integrated it sounded very lively but with a surprising amount of gain, so much so that it was annoying, got loud very soon after zero on the volume pot and WAY too loud pretty soon after that. Using the remote to adjust volume was a non-starter, had to do it by hand in the tiniest increments.

But, like I said, it sounded good, sparkly, a lot of detail. I also know the DL103 has a strange output impedance so I figured it wasn't mating well with the Allnic and didn't think about it.

A while ago I made a trade with a guy for some records and also got a Denon SUT from the 70s, a 310 that I believe was actually made for the 103 (when I took it from the guy I did so thinking eventually I'd get around to trying a 103). So I dug this out (bit of a project, couldn't remember where I put it) and brought it into the office. Now the 310 has a passthrough button so you can disengage the transformers if you choose. When I hooked it up I discovered that with the transformers engaged I still had way too much gain, and with them disengaged, well, the cart sounded good and loud.

So I put on a Shure m97xe, another cart I run here at the office. A-B'ing it against this cart purporting to be a DL-103 with the trannies disengaged I found that at the same volume setting on the Marantz the "DL103" played a little louder than the Shure.

And, as I'm sure most of you know at least vaguely... that ain't right. The m97xe has an output voltage of 4mv. A true DL103 has an output voltage of in the country of .3mv.

So... it's gotta be a fake right? There's nothing I'm missing here? It's not a bad sounding cart at all whatever it is, but it can't be a DL-103.
davelarz
davelarz OP
40 posts
 
Didn’t come with a data sheet or any original materials. I got my money back - he offered a refund right away. I buy and sell a lot of records and in the last few years I’ve become aware of a general scam on the internet - eBay certainly - whereby a seller advertises a record as being VG+ and then I buy the record and it is nowhere near that grade. When I respond they instantly refund the money and don’t even ask to have the disc returned. I believe their thinking is - I have a pile of records that are worthless due to their condition. If I sell them as vg+ and get away with it I’ve made a profit and if I get called on it all I’m out is shipping, which via media mail is very cheap. You have 10 such records and you get away with it for 5 of them, you’ve turned a profit. I suspect this is what my dl103 seller was up to - selling something that is worthless on the market under false pretenses and hoping I didn’t know enough to call him on it, figuring if I did he’d just refund and only be out the minimal shipping cost of a cartridge. 

i have many other cartridges btw - very sound on that front. 😋
lewm
6,770 posts
 
Chakster, We’ve had this discussion (about the "protection" afforded by Paypal) before. I am glad you found them to be helpful. The one time I needed to resort to Paypal for help with a dishonest seller, they were worthless. In fact, the Paypal representative advised me to seek help from VISA, via my credit card. Fortunately, VISA did help. Lucky for me that I had not paid via my own checking account through Paypal. I would have been out of luck.

Dave, I would bet that you got a high output MC Denon (forgot the numerical designation) with an outer shell that gives the appearance of a DL103. You would probably not readily discern the difference in its output from that of your MM standard, even though it’s lower in terms of voltage by half. That’s only 3db. Anyway, all’s well that ends well.
davelarz OP
40 posts
 
It’s been suggested that it’s a homc Denon but... look, but for a red tube attaching to the cantilever instead of a white one this was an exact lookalike of a dl103 including serial number. Given that homc denons don’t retail for that much more than dl103s it’s hard to imagine someone going to the trouble to Frankenstein such a cart. I realize no one wants to believe it but I remain convinced it was a straight up fake manufactured for exactly the purpose of ripping off people who don’t know any better.
chakster's avatar
chakster
2,482 posts
 
@lewm 

Chakster, We’ve had this discussion (about the "protection" afforded by Paypal) before. I am glad you found them to be helpful. The one time I needed to resort to Paypal for help with a dishonest seller, they were worthless. In fact, the Paypal representative advised me to seek help from VISA, via my credit card. Fortunately, VISA did help. Lucky for me that I had not paid via my own checking account through Paypal. I would have been out of luck. 
 
There is a claim/refund/return option for every payment made with paypal now. You case may be too old to talk about it, but i'm talking about how it works right now for everyone who pay for "goods", not "family and friends option" with paypal. This "buyers protection" make no chance for cheaters who use paypal as payment option. Their PP account will be blocked by paypal even if there is a money on the balance.   
lewm
6,770 posts
 
Perhaps you make a valid point.  The incident I described occurred about 5 or more years ago.  Maybe Paypal is offering better protection these days.
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