2. amps-preamps
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Bryston 4B3 vs Mac MC462 vs Pass Labs X250.8, OR... GRYPHON Diablo 300?

Hi,
Over the next few weeks I am organizing in-home demo of  three pre/power amps for my B&W 803D2's, and will purchase whichever sounds best.  I will be testing the following gear, which is based on what's available where live:
-Bryston B173 / 4B3-McIntosh C47 / MC462
-Pass Labs X250.8, if I can get my hands on one (will probably use the C47 pre-amp to test with this)
The Gryphon Diablo 300 is also a candidate.  I've seen some strong comments from others that Gryphon is in another league compared to the others.
My question is, barring what sounds best to me during my auditioning, in general to most people would the Diablo 300 really beat the others in my list?  And, are there any material disadvantages to sound quality considering the Diablo is an integrated vs the other choices?  I don't really care about having separates, but sound is obviously important.
Secondly related to the Gryphon, there is only one Gryphon dealer that is even remotely close to me.  Should that dealer cut ties down the road, or go out of business, does anyone know how I might go about getting service for the Diablo should I require it at some point?  Is that a valid concern?  There are multiple Mac dealers near me so that would not be so much of a concern.

Thanks in advance for any feedback....


nyev
inna
5,245 posts
 
I think, you definitely need another audition. One thing about Gryphon you certainly got right. It has a great grip on speakers and you feel the amp's presence. In a manner of speaking, it is quite authoritarian. 
nyev OP
57 posts
 
That is a perfect way to describe it “you feel the amp’s presence”.  It is difficult to describe this effect in a non-subjective way.  It is like the amp is curating the music for you, the way it wants to  (and doing a very, very good job of it).  What I’m wrestling with is whether I like this effect vs an amp that “disappears”.  No one I’ve seen has commented on this control element being a negative factor, so maybe I would be able to stop focusing on it so much after some extended listening sessions.  I doubt that can happen over an in-store audition.  On one hand I really like the effect.  On the other, I seem to notice it a bit too much and it’s distracting.  Now that I think of it - I did see one person on another forum say it was too controlled and not free-flowing enough for them.  But that’s the only one.

inna
5,245 posts
 
nyev, you have a great perception of the sound. This amp/speakers interaction is a complicated thing. I myself like speakers that are slightly loose and give me a somewhat 'bluesy' sound. But this kind of speakers need an amp with a firm grip not to get out of control. It should be a right balance, and it can be a matter of preference. It appears that this Gryphon/B&W pair does not strike the right balance, though it does certain things very well. That's why you are so ambivalent. Just don't buy if you are not sure.
What I also know about Flemming, I watched a number of interviews with him, is that he likes large scale music. This influenced his designs.
I understand what you call "flow" of music. Again, it's interesting and not simple. For example, and that's not about amps or speakers, it is about the sources, both analog in this case. My Nottingham turntable overall sounds much better than Nakamichi cassette deck. But, music has more coherence and flow when played on tape, tape recorded off vinyl played on the same Nottingham. I also once noticed the disruption of the flow with a wrong interconnect cables.

morg111
16 posts
 
Nyve,

Boooo....no 462 review!?!?

; )

I’m getting the Bryston 14b3.. Besides, went to the Mac house in Manhattan, and they were rude. Now I need to figure out a preamp for uae with my ML 15a’s. Gonna keep using my Cambridge 851n as the preamp in the interim.
nyev OP
57 posts
 
Sorry Morg, the shop had set up the 462 for me but the Gryphon was so unique there was no point in comparing with the 462, at least for me, and I had too much to focus on with the Diablo.

As I said if my choice was between Bryston and Mac I’d go Bryston without question.  And that’s based on my test of the 4B3 and 452.  You give up a bit of the Mac’s fully fleshed our mids but you gain so much more in dynamics, timing, drive and bass.  Best of luck with the 14B3!

If I end up buying the Diablo and if it doesn’t work out for some reason, my fallback will be to sell it and go with the 14B3 and a suitable TBD preamp.  There is no way for me to be totally sure of how the the Diablo will do with my 803 D2’s before buying, and as I said the D3 line I’m testing it with in the shop has elements that don’t agree with me, which is actually the very reason I chose my D2’s and not the D3 at the time I bought them.
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