Tonearms with no anti-skate adjustment

moonglum

Your beliefs are contrary to those who have measured the force at the elevated stylus point and compared with “horizontal” arm measurements for VTF.

Have you performed such measurement to confirm your belief?

It isn’t clear what you’re asking here.

I can tell you that - all other things being equal - if you increase the height of a statically balanced pickup arm, you will also increase VTF, however slightly. Similarly, if you decrease the height of a statically balanced pickup arm, you will decrease VTF, however slightly. You can easily measure this with a proper VTF gauge.

I’m really surprised that there is any debate about this. It’s pretty basic geometry and physics, and easily measured.

And yes, I’ve measured it.

This thread doesn’t need to go on and on and on. If you want a quality tonearm, properly designed by engineers who know what they’re doing, buy one with anti-skate. Simple.

When you change the vertical position of a pivot, you are in effect changing the horizontal distance between the stylus/record and pivot point of a fixed length tonearm, which in turn changes the balance. As we reduce the distance between stylus/record and pivot, the measured force at the stylus tip will be reduced.  Any adjustment to the vertical position of the pivot that results in the pivot interface and the stylus/record not being inline will result in a lowered measured force.

This can be easily demonstrated. Hold a 5lb weight 45 degrees away from your body (the weight will be farthest from you body). Do the same at 23 and 67 degrees. Tell me which one feels heavier when the only thing that has change is the distance between you (pivot) and the weight.

The best explanation and use of anti-skate was a paper delivered with a rebuilt cartridge from Soundsmith.  To make a multi-page explanation short, it is necessary but in most cases much more heavily applied than is needed.

I recommend a thorough read of Peter Ledermann's paper and remarks before forming any judgement.

Moonglum, Just to clear up a basic point in our discussion, I think/thought that originally you were claiming that LOWERING the pivot point would.... etc.  But in your last post, you are talking about RAISING the pivot point.  In the latter case, the set VTF will go up, because your shoving more of the total mass onto the cantilever/stylus which must support it.  So, to summarize my position, move pivot point down in the vertical direction and the set VTF goes down.  Move pivot point up in the vertical, and the set VTF goes up.  And this is for a static balanced tonearm.  For a dynamically balanced tonearm, one with springs, etc, to set VTF, the effect is largely obviated.

A very simple analogy is to think of two guys carrying a sofa up a staircase.  Which guy is bearing most of the weight?  The guy on the bottom.

Testpilot, You wrote, "Any adjustment to the vertical position of the pivot that results in the pivot interface and the stylus/record not being inline will result in a lowered measured force."  I don't know what the phrase "pivot inteface and the stylus/record not being in line" means, but I do believe that moving the pivot down vs up does not have the same effect on VTF.  Maybe if I better understood your lingo, I would agree.