12ax7 vs 5751

Not saying that Joe's tube lore is the total and final authority. Brent Jesse is another good one with a lot of specifics, historic retrospect and very good general advice on what to look for.

But when it comes to comparing same category tubes between themselves, it was the best reference I could find in a simple straightforward useful reference. I've followed, just for fun, many of his advices both with 6922-7308 and 12AX7-5751 tubes and found out Joe's conclusions were the same on both my systems. Not saying it is the fundemental truth, but subjectively it was to me.

Grayf, your choice of the GE5751WA is a good one. It is one of my favorite. It has a nice laidback sound, deep soundstage with quite a tight crunch of the percussions. Electric guitar on that one is pure heaven. If you lunge for smooth soft jazz or instrumental with the most profound and lush feminin voices, the Sylvanias are the ones to get. The black plated, three mica ones. God I love those ! True, they bring everything forward, in your face, but quite a unique sound. If you get them, do some tube rolling to preserve them as long as you can.

Andr, well stated couldn't agree more; love those Sylvania's, have them in one of my units. Like you, I tube roll them out periodically, for instance, roll in the GE for Neil Young or other guitar stuff...

I agree with Rccc that the only way to really know is to experiment--tube performance is very specific to the particular application, and in addition, there is the matter of individual taste. This can be, unfortunately, quite expensive. The advice of any one user, no matter how many types of tubes were tried, only apply to that particular user's gear and taste.

That said, there are certain tubes that "tend" to be acceptable in a broad range of applications and to a broad range of listener taste. The 5751s discussed above fall in that category. I would also put in that category Amperex Bugle Boy 12AX7s.

I have found, for my particular application and taste, the Telefunken ECC803S to be the best, but, that tube can be excessively detailed, lean and "analytical" in the wrong system (it has also become crazy expensive). I took a big gamble with getting those, because I did not have an opportunity to hear them before purchasing (a friend lent me a BIG selection of 5751s and 12AX7s to try, including Telefunken ECC83s, but no ECC803S).

Have fun, just don't go broke in the process.

Joe' Tube Lore basically says what you posted above, no one really disagrees with what you have stated; but for a newby to tubes, Joe is a good starting point in order not to go broke. There are many tube gurus out there, Jim McShane, Kevin Deal at Upscale, Brent Jesse and so forth, consult with the folks who have solid reps, or someone you know and trust to help with advise and to narrow your search. The Tube Store has also been helpful to me, as well as the others mentioned above.

hiya guys these are great feedbacks and you`re all helping so much. can`t thank you all enough.

well i also ordered some jan philips 5751`s and got them this morning. of course i put them in straight away!

ok my initial impressions so far and also keeping in mind that these are nos tubes so they will need breaking in. i really like them. they have an added warmth and are just as detailed as the psvane 12ax7t`s. i seem to have lost a little soundstage width but gained some depth. also i`ve lost the added punch in the bass that the psvanes had but the bass is still very seductive, deep and pleasing. listening to adeles cd her voice still has that natural dryness but with these tubes there`s an added warmth and to me there seems more detail and depth to her voice. in the soundstage there is also more precision than the psvanes but less seperation due the soundstage not being as wide but i`m not talking by much. i do have one criticism though, one of my very favourite cd`s steve hillage green, some of the synth notes seems dull and less involving as does his voice on a couple of tracks. i use this cd to check out the high frequencies and these tubes pass with flying colours! every bit as pleasing as the psvanes but it`s such a shame about those synthesiser note and his voice but as i`ve said, these tubes only have about 4 hours on them and they`ll more than likely open up at some stage and that`s going to make this experiment much more interesting! so far if i had to choose between the psvanes and the philips the psvanes would just about edge it so lets see what happens when the philips tubes open up!

the tubes i`m currently waiting on now are the ge tubes, sylvania 5751`s and the kt88-z treasure tubes. this is all getting so interesting. i`ll keep you all posted at every stage. i have to say too that i bought the jan philips 5751 tubes from a uk vendor and ordered them over the phone. this guy was fantastic and very knowledgable about tubes in general. we spent the best part of an hour discussing tubes and being given all kinds of advice. i`m having the time of my life even though this is sucking the hell out of my finances!!! you gets what you pays for i think! more to come soon guys :)