2. amps-preamps
  3. 1399374353

HYPEX,PASCAL OR ABLETEC

Knowing about the many apparently very good class D amps on the market right now and even though I'm very satisfied with my current ClassD Audio SDS-440CS amp, I'm seriously considering purchasing one of these amps to try out in my system. My thinking is that, if I do like the amp in my system, I can just use my current amp to replace an older Adcom GFA-545 that currently powers my Magnepan CC3 center channel and my unamplified (passive)sub for ht purposes. I would then always be able to choose which amp I used for my 2 ch music and which amp I used for ht(cc and sub).

Well, I should get to my point:

I'm using an Oppo105 as the master source in my streamlined A/V living room system used 40% for 2-ch music and 60% for ht. For 2-ch listening, I stream my cd collection and hi-res Flac files from a Synology NAS in another room to the Oppo. The Oppo acts as a stand alone dac and sends the analog output via xlr cables to my class D amp (440 w/ch@4ohms) which powers my Magnepan 2.7qr speakers. For ht, I use the Oppo for decoding surround sound from Netflix, Directv and bluray discs. Two class A/B amps power the Oppo's ht audio outputs to my Magnepan CC3 center channel, LFE sub and in-ceiling rear surround channels.
I've narrowed my new amp choices down to the following four listed below. I'm requesting feedback on any or all of these 4 amp options, especially from anyone who has used 1 or more in their system. My budget is $2,000 to $2,500 and my room is 18ft x 13ft with 8ft ceilings. Here are my options:

Option#1 Hypex Ncore nc400 based amp builds from James Romeyn in Utah. A stereo, dual-mono build is $1,500 total and is rated at 400 watts @ 4 ohms. It includes 2 Hypex nc400 power modules both powered by 1 nc12000 smps mounted in a generic case with a black or silver aluminum faceplate with both se and xlr inputs. A pair of mono-blocks built runs a bit under $2,000/pr. total and consists of a nc400 power module mated to a nc600 smps in each 'NCORE' labeled black case with both se and xlr inputs.

Option#2 Pascal amp build from Aluminati Sound in Ohio. This is a stereo build only that will use a new stereo board from Pascal in Denmark, called the SPRO-2, that has a smps incorporated on the board. Power output is rated at 500 watts/ch @ 4 ohms. Forecasted price is about $2,000 but may run a bit higher. Pascal modules are used in the new JRRG Continuum 2 integrated amp that has received very positive sq reviews. Alumnati is owned by 2 former CNC machinists/fabricators. Their main advantage is their case work. One of the Aluminati owners, Matt Kraemer, told me the new stereo Pascal amp is tentatively named the "X-1" and should be available for order by approx. mid July. He said the stereo case will be milled from a single large aluminum block. The finished case will have an anodized finish (think JRRG cases but milled as 1 solid piece instead of multiple anodized face panels attached to a chassis underneath. The aluminum case will have a blue power/status light mounted underneath projecting downward.

Option#3- Abletec amp modules in the DSonic M3-600M mono-blocks. I'm not certain which Abletec modules are used in these amps but the price is $1,950/pr. and power output is 600 watts/ch @ 4 ohms in black cases with a blue power/status light with both se and xlr inputs. The Abletec modules have built-in smps just like the Pascal modules. According to DSonic's owner, Dennis Deacon, the 600Ms and their top-of-the-line 1500Ms have similar sound characteristics, even though the 1500Ms use Pascal modules(likely either a MPro or XPro module).

Option#4- Identical ClassD Audio SDS-440CS amp to replace my older class A/B amp that powers my center ch and sub. This option is least attractive to me since it would mean my music amplification would remain the same and I wouldn't be auditioning any of the newer class D amp modules. If I liked option 1,2 or 3 above better for music playback, I would simply move my existing CDA music amp over to center and sub duties anyways. The only benefit of option #4 is that it's the least expensive at $630.

I've ruled out some amps, like the Wyred4Sound and Red Dragon offerings, because they use the older Ice ucd power modules typically considered sonically inferior to the newer Hypex Ncore, Pascal and Abletec power modules. Any comments comparing the sq of these options is greatly appreciated, especially if you've owned or listened to some of these. I do understand that there is more involved with how various class D amps sound than just the power modules utilized, such as high quality components and custom input stages.

I should also say, just like Audiozen, I have never actually heard a Hypex, Pascal or Abletec powered amp. I'm just curious and base my optimism on the positive reports from owners, listeners and professional reviewers. If I had a larger $10k plus budget, I'd likely just buy a completed amp based on the Hypex Ncore nc1200 power modules, such as Merrill, upcoming Mola-Mola or Acoustic Imagery.

Thank you in advance for your thoughts, comments and suggestions. Please feel free to suggest other reasonably priced class D amps I may have omitted.

Thank you,
Tim



Much like Audiozen, I am basing
128x128noble100
sebollo001
39 posts
 
Since Murphythecat has the Amphion One 18 Speakers, it makes a lot of sense for him to try an Anaview AMS amplifier, which has been optimized for his speakers and beats the NC400 in this setup.

Other users also have reported that AMS1000 performance beats the NC400. Nobody that has compared both modules has preferred the NC400. Of course, we have to consider the context of every test and comparison. Every system and playback chain is different. But we have to accept that reviews performed by experienced members are valuable, and right now, the AMS module is "statistically" preferred over the NC400.

Kuribo, since you are very strict about specifications and don't seem to trust other opinions, I think it would be great if you had first hand experience with both NC400 and AMS technologies at the same time, and contribute to the forum with your review and comparison.

To the rest of the audiogon members, I can confirm that AMS technology is a really serious and excellent performer. I did not compare it head to head with NC400, because I understood from the specifications that the power capabilities of the AMS1000 module (in my case 2 x AMS1000 in BTL mode) and dynamic headroom are superior to the Ncore NC400. I considered the NC1200 against the AMS1000, but the price/performance ratio of the Ncore is not attractive, IMO. I also read several member reviews in other forums, to have an idea of the treble and general performance with several speakers of the new AMS technology, before finally making my decision.

As a first hand experience contribution to this forum, I tested the AMS1000-2600 in my system as well as Hi-Fi store. I was able to compare it against an ATI AT1202 and McIntosh MC601 amplifiers, using several preamps and speakers (B&W 805S, 804D, 803D and 802D, Dynaudio Confidence C2). I can say that the D-Sonic M3-600M-A, made of AMS1000-2600 modules was clearly the best performer, in those systems with those components.

The AMS module has better power characteristics and is more comparable to the NC1200 than to the NC400.
There is a DIY group buy of AMS1000 amplifiers going on, and there will be new comparisons very soon.
But, as far as Amphion and Anaview matching, we already have a clear leader.
Sebastian
sebollo001
39 posts
 
Some Pascal news for you...

Raidho amplifier - The Aavik Acoustics U-300 integrated amplifier [€24'000] from the Raidho team combines a 24/192 DAC with 2 each Toslink, coax and USB inputs with adjustable phono and three line-level inputs; 3/6/12dB adjustable gain assignable to each line input; and class D Pascal power modules for 300/600wpc into 8/4 ohms said to be unconditionally stable into lower impedances.

http://www.monoandstereo.com/2014/11/aavik-acoustics-u-300-unity-amplifier.html

Cheers,
Sebastian
ddeacon
4 posts
 
Sebollo001,

Please explain your following comment:

"D-Sonic does not include an input buffer in front of the AMS power module. This requires careful matching with the preamp."

This is not an issue with the AMS1000 designer or any customer that I am aware of.

Dennis
noble100's avatar
noble100 OP
1,093 posts
 


My opinion is that Bruno and Hypex had a strategy before they launched/released their 1st modules. They knew what they had the ability to build modules of a wide variety of power outputs as well as a wide range of sonic performance levels; from a basic/'vanilla' grade with their own discrete input section to a high performance grade that had a standard ic input section that OEMs could easily replace with their own proprietary input sections tailored to the OEM's own preferences.

The strategy consisted of releasing:

1, A lower,but still respectfully, powered module to the DIY market as the NC400. This module would have a basic discrete input section since many DIYers may not have the skills needed to build their own. Pricing would be reasonably low to spur DIY sales.

2. The highest powered module would be released to the p.a. and home audio amplifier manufacturers (OEMs). This module would have a simple ic input section that could easily be removed and replaced by the OEM's custom inputs that they design themselves and that tailor the sound to their needs and sound preferences. These would be unique and proprietary to each OEM. Pricing would be relatively high and be restricted to OEMs only.

3.
noble100's avatar
noble100 OP
1,093 posts
 
My opinion is that Bruno and Hypex had a strategy before they released their 1st modules. They knew that they had the ability to build modules of a wide variety of power outputs as well as a wide range of sonic performance levels; from a basic/'vanilla' grade with their own discrete input section to a high performance grade that would come with a standard ic input section that OEMs could easily replace with their own proprietary input sections tailored to the OEM's own preferences. Hypex would offer input section fee-based design assistance from Hypex engineers so that OEMs could attain the highest performance levels from these modules if desired.

The strategy consisted of releasing:

1, A lower,but still respectfully, powered module to the DIY market as the NC400. This module would have a basic discrete input section since many DIYers may not have the skills needed to build their own. Pricing would be reasonably low to spur DIY sales.

2. A very high powered module, the NC1200, to the p.a. and home audio amplifier manufacturers (OEMs). This module would have a simple ic input section that could easily be removed and replaced by the OEM's custom inputs that they would design themselves, or with the fee-based assistance of Hypex engineers, that tailors the sound to their preferences and wrings the highest known level of performance from the modules. These would be unique and proprietary to each OEM. Pricing would be relatively high and be restricted to OEMs only.

3. There would be a series of other modules, at various power output levels, that could be released to the DIY or OEM markets at Hypex'a discretion based on demand and market conditions. These modules would be produced with the basic input sections if intended for the DIY market or easily replaced ic input sections if intended for the OEM market. Hypex engineers would only be available to OEMs.

My opinion, unsubstantiated by anything remotely resembling proof, is that Hypex has insider knowledge of how to wring a high level of performance from any of their modules, no matter the power output. I think this knowledge is available, but only to OEMs and only for a fee. The #1 goal of any business is to leveredge their resources, which includes proprietary knowledge, to maximize profits.

Again, this is only my 2 cents worth, based mainly on a bachelors degree in Economics and some resultant knowledge concerning how corporations generally behave and operate.

Thanks,
Tim
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