Fed Ex Ground Shipping Woes

The person who purchased the shipping insurance (normally the shipper) is the screwee.

This is from the Sellers rules in the Audiogon policy guidelines:

What if an item is damaged in shipping?
If an item is damaged in shipping, the seller should contact the shipping company immediately so that a Damage Claim can be filed. The responsibility of filing a Damage Claim is solely with the seller. The Buyer will need to cooperate with the shipping company, which will either inspect the item at the Buyer's location, or pick up the item for further processing. In most cases, the shipping company will return the item to the Seller, and expect the seller to pursue the claim.

Audiogon requires that Sellers are responsible for the safe transport of sold items to the Buyer. If the item is damaged or lost in transit, the Seller is expected to refund the payment to the Buyer as soon as the shipping company inspects or returns the item. The Seller will then need to recover funds from the shipping company.

This is the quote from the buyers AudiogoN guidelines:

What if an item is damaged in shipping?
If an item is damaged in shipping, you should contact the seller immediately so that a Damage Claim is filed. The responsibility of pursuing a Damage Claim is solely with the seller. However, you will need to cooperate with the seller and the shipping company in any manner requested. Often, the shipping company will come back to pick it up, or inspect the package in your home.

Keep all of the packing and materials exactly as you received it. Do not attempt to use the item or plug it in, which may result in further damage. Do not attempt to disassemble or repair the item unless the seller first agrees.

If a seller and a buyer cannot agree on a course of action to follow, a "Dispute" may be filed with Audiogon:
http://www.audiogon.com/help/disp/drp.html

Generally speaking, the Seller is expected to refund to the buyer, and recover the money by pursuing the damage claim. Shipping companies generally pay the seller only and it may take some time. The Buyer should not have to wait until the claim is processed. Essentially, it is the Seller's responsiblity to deliver the item to the buyer in an undamaged condition.

Good luck,
John

IMO, there is a fundamental flaw with Audogon's statement. If Audiogon is
going to make such detailed policy statements, then Audiogon should take
into consideration who has possession of the damaged goods.

If the seller is expected to refund the money immediately to the buyer, then
the buyer will (usually) have both the component and the money, and the
seller will have nothing. This is not equitable. There are many circumstances
of partial insurance claims paid. Let's say a faceplate has been damaged and
the component is otherwise fully functional. If the buyer has the component
and the full refund, and if the insurance company pays the seller $200 for the
faceplate damage, then the seller is now relying on the good faith of the
buyer to return the component, or to return the refund. Essentially, the seller
is left without any leverage, and is open to potential fraud by the buyer who
keeps the money and the component.

Now, if the component is picked up by the shipping company for inspection,
and is no longer in the buyer's possession, then refunding the buyer's money
is more equitable, as the shipper has the leverage of the contract to force the
shipping company to return the component or face a lawsuit.

IMO.

I had a situation where I took speaker components to UPS and had them pack the items. The buyer later contacted me and showed me photos of the severe damage inflicted during the shipping process. What was strange was that the buyer refused to contact his local UPS to have them inspect the damage. I'm not sure why he refused, but I informed him that if he didn't I wouldn't be able to file an insurance claim and without being able to file a claim, I wouldn't return his money. (I did say if he helped with the claim I would give him a full refund.) I had to play hardball with the buyer because otherwise I could be without the product, without the money paid and without the ability to recoup anything from the shipper. Under some very specific circumstances there are some major flaws in the system.

Onhwy61 offers a perfect case study of why the Audiogon position statement quoted above is flawed.

Yes, Audiogon needs to say this is the normal way to deal with this situation. I once sold a quality turntable to a guy that FedEx Ground nearly destroyed and returned to me. Even the FedEx guy who returned it said "it looks like we did our best to destroy it."

FedEx said that they would consider repairing it but not declare it totaled. It was made in the UK, and I quickly moved to contact the company and to send pictures. Fortunately they were very helpful and gave a "worse case" estimate that FedEx honored. I sent it off and the company did and excellent repair.

The buyer in the mean time was bitching about my screwing him. When he got it back in first class condition, he apologized to me repeatedly.