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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
I prefer to not sound like I am going nuts but maybe that is what it sounds like.

You may be right Undertow on the Clarity being the best for the $. There is a difference in Poly's no doubt.

Sound of Supreme's
They do give the system more bass.
They are slightly slower. (than vintage)
They have less noise than vintage.

Effects on "A Day in the Life" Beatles (+2 on bass tone controls you gotta love 'em)

With the vintage caps the song has wonderful balance and is beautiful. Ringo is drumming is his own space and Paul is playing bass to the right everything in balance orchestra behind. (until the end when it is brought forward) There is a time when John voice is made to float.

The Mundorf Supreme's shift tonal balance to the bass. The balance of the song is out of whack. (paul now dominates) Ringo's druming is slower. There is not even close to as much front to back in the sound stage. Everything is more etched and harder sounding. The sound is also more aggressive. The Supreme's are a aggressive dynamic cap. Maybe that is why some preferred the Sonicaps and called them more neutral. Kind of like fake dynamics. Like a loudness switch.

The vintage/Dueland paints a beauty and Mundorf almost attacks you. I guess I can see why some like Sonicaps better this would get tiring after awhile and not sound natural.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Tonight I am going to pull out the Mundorf and do a burn in on a lamp.

This will take the caps up in hours without having them in the system for 400 hours!

I see why guys do things to burn caps in. If you don't like them 400 hours is an eternity!
hifisoundguy
630 posts
 
Could these new VTV silver foil in oil caps be the new king of caps from Vacuum Tube Valley?.... http://www.vacuumtube.com/VTV%20Ultratonecaps.htm
undertow
1,032 posts
 
Hifisoundguy
Nope. And I think they already went right back out of business even though that ad is from 2007 that you see in your link, from my understanding with some being sold off in bulk to whoever will use them.. I remember something about counterpoint using these exact caps for years and all at some point within a few years would many times just fail and need to be replaced, hence the guy that was counterpoint started that altavista site or whatever to actually do upgrades and start removing all these.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
HiFisoundguy I had seen those ones too did not know they were out of business?

What makes foil caps so expensive to make? I know they say they are hand made at Duelund and of course that costs. But why do they have to be hand made?

If labour is the main costs I am surprised there are not Chinese knock-offs? Or are there?

I did notice on putting back in the vintage caps that the noise was slightly higher than Mundorf. (but I did know that before) I have wondered about what can be done to them to quiet midrange vintage caps down? (tweeter caps are just to far off Duelund) Could they be dipped in something? Would that work? I did go up and flick the midcaps to see if I could hear some vibration distortion and could not. So is the higher noise level not caused by external factors but internal?

On the upside foil caps are much more musical with nothing sounding out of whack. The (very short hour Mundorfs) tend to exaggerate sounds of instruments and of course sound harsh and slow.
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