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We Need A Separate Forum for Fuses

LOL, I'll bet I gotcha on that Title! ;)  BTW, I put this thread under "Tech Talk" category as it involves the system physically, not tangentially. 

More seriously, two question survey:

1. Do you think designer fuses are A) a Gift to audiophiles, or B) Snake Oil 

2. Have you ever tried them?  Yes or No

In the tradition of such questions on Agon, I'll weigh in as we go along... 
Feel free to discuss and rant all you wish, but I would like to see clear answers to the questions. :) 
douglas_schroeder
shadorne's avatar
shadorne
7,333 posts
 
Mercedes have been winning F1 championships with Lewis Hamilton and after market fuses. Lewis only pits for fuel, tires or after market specialty fuses. They have Bayesian computer algorithms to determine which fuses to use and when. Some fuses work well in the wet and some are better at higher altitude and some will lower the aerodynamic drag of the vehicle, others are excellent for braking. Fuses are so important  they call it F1.  
uberwaltz's avatar
uberwaltz
4,946 posts
 
Kosst
I would agree that the number of aftermarket fuse users is indeed small, tens of thousands as you say.
However it is not in a market of tens of millions that they should be related to.
Those tens of millions are NOT high end audiophiles. That group number significantly less and dwindling every day unfortunately.
The tens of millions include appliances and applications that have no relation to high end audio at all.
Tbh I really do not know what the number of audiophiles would be worldwide, I do not believe would number tens of millions at all but I do not have that data to hand.
As far as perception of reality, I would need a few more drinks before entering that arena.
kosst_amojan
2,095 posts
 
Stereophile’s monthly circulatiy in 2013 was 72,156. I think it’s safe to assume their website traffic is much higher than that. I can’t find any total numbers for the big forum sites. The US loudspeaker market by itself was $1.44 billion last year. That doesn’t include Bluetooth speakers, sound bars, or the like. The home audio market is worth $3 billion.
auxinput
1,538 posts
 

I understand people who do not believe fuses make any difference and I understand trying to ask for "measured proof".  However, I do not think it's cool at all make it one's mission to ensure any new users are discouraged from the idea of trying aftermarket fuses at all.  That's almost like a "religious extremist" attitude.  If you have not actually sat down and listened to different aftermarket fuses, I really don't think you have any real objectivity to say that "fuses do not make any difference at all".  For those who have actually listening to fuses, I think I have seen exactly ONE user who posted that they could not hear any difference (which is totally fine!).  All other people on here that have actually experimented with fuses have posted that they do, indeed, hear differences (whether it is positive or negative for them).  There is definitely an electrical character that happens with fuses, since they are inline to transfer current/electricity.  The same goes for power cords, interconnect, speaker wire.  I think there are definitely a few things about fuses that can dictate how the end-result sound is:

- conductor material, such as silver, gold, copper, and tin can contribute to the character of sound (just like power cord material).

- conductor / end-cap plating (such as gold-plating, silver-plating, rhodium plating).  Just like power cords, this can influence sound from A/C current.

- internal conductor material / damping (such as filler material or liquid - like beeswax or power type filler).  This helps reduce electrical resonance that happens on that very small wire.  The glass tube or ceramic tube can also affect electrical resonance.

The above points can probably be measured in some way (there is definitely measured results on the conductivity of different materials such as copper/silver/rhodium).  Though, I'm not sure anyone will really sit down and actually do these types of measurements on fuses because, at this point, it doesn't really have any fiscal value to do.  There is no "return on investment" to spends thousands or tens of thousands to do these level of tests.

As far as cost is concerned, it's all about perceived value and "what the market will bear".  In my testing, I definitely have no problems spending $60 on a fuse upgrade.  I'm not to the point where I want to put $150 on a Synergistic BLUE, but many others have and love their fuse.  Though, I can understand other points of view.  Just like why a person would drop  6 grand on a Rolex watch when you can spend a few hundred to get a nice item that does the same thing. 

kosst_amojan
2,095 posts
 
Auxinput, 
Really, the folks in favor of fuses are much more the religious zealots than I am. There's no objectivity to their conclusions. Of the tends of thousands of tweakers and DIY'ers out there with benches full of gear, none of them seem to have substantiated the claims made about fuses, or exotic outlet materials, or a host of other claims. It's just patently false that any human has hearing more sensitive than your average scope. I'm curious what's going on here, why people think they're hearing things. But the claims being made so often are hard to believe. 
You're going on about end cap material, conductor, and the envelope... Over 1 inch of circuit! What about the other 100 feet that are 5 or 10 percent tolerance? Traces on PCB that are just plain old copper. Lead solder joints. The yards and yards of wire in the transformer. You know what they use in sensitive circuits in computers that need protection? They use high quality, purpose built resistors. It's an entire categoy of resistors made to do that. You can get them with all kinds of properties. There's just so much that seems fishy to me in all of this. 
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