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Seller is responsible to get item to you, intact. yes? or no?

Is the seller responsible for packing and shipping? or not? Should the seller insist on a safe form of shipping? (and if the seller does insist, can he make the buyer pay for air, or 2-day?) or can the buyer say ship cheap (even though the seller eats the shipping fail?) ((And DOES the buyer eat the broken equipment cost?))                  
Who should be worried about insurance... the buyer? or the seller? Since it it is lost or broken, the buyer can get his/her money back. (usually)  
My 'take' is that the person AT RISK for loss is the SELLER. And the SELLER should certainly be needing the insurance. (Notice the seller is the person who has to collect insurance, NOT the buyer)... So IMO the Seller should be including the cost of insurance IN THE ASKING PRICE. Since the seller is the one 'needing' the insurance.                   
The other side is why should the buyer PAY for insurance when the seller is the one being protected by insurance?            
I have asked this before long ago, and the main answer seems to be FURY on the part of (mainly) sellers claiming they have no part in any shipping fail, that they say it is 100% on the buyer. (to which I just laugh)Where I would say the shipping packing, and burden of surety is 100% on the seller/person shipping.So what's your thoughts on it today...(like I said, I asked this years ago, and got a LOT of flack for even claiming the seller is the bad guy, and is responsible 100% of the time for the insurance and proper packing and insurance against loss.) So I thought it was a pertinent question. and wonder what all you folks think, today?

elizabeth
elizabeth OP
6,726 posts
 
I think anyone reading any audio forums has realized shippers never want to pay, and they always blame the packaging.
I tell folks pack it so you can comfortably drop the package on a corner from ten feet up. And no problem.
As mentioned it is the cushioning inside the box that matters. The more weight, the denser and thicker the foam needed.
But IMO the drop from ten feet is to be EXPECTED.
My favorite horror story UPS style: I was at the main depot terminal UPS off Bluemound Rd near the Milwaukee County border with Waukesha County(not some store) and as I waited in line, A UPS employee pushed open a swinging door with a skid on wheels, carrying a very large box. The box was WIDER than the door.. However the employee refused to accept it would not fit. And began to pull back, and try to bang the box HARD ... into submission, over and over, As I and half a dozen customers watched. finally after about ten tries to force the box through the too small opening. The owner of the item walked in and started yelling. (by then my need to stay was no more,and I left. Not knowing what finally happened. I do think if the box had been rotated 90 degrees... it would have fit through the door. UPS....ups..
slaw's avatar
slaw
5,785 posts
 
Yes. Duh?
stevecham
3,298 posts
 
From a legal perspective, transfer of ownership does not happen until buyer receives the product as described.
tomcy6's avatar
tomcy6
1,368 posts
 
We all seem to agree that the seller is responsible to get the item to you safely, however, that responsibility is meaningless if you don't pay with Paypal or a credit card.  If you pay wth cash, check or money order chances are you will never see any of your money again.
glennewdick's avatar
glennewdick
702 posts
 

I've always posted giving a fair price that does not included the shipping or insurance. I always state i will not ship with out proper declaration of price or adequate insurance at buyers expense. I do this to cover both our asses if something happens during shipping. I also do not include any of the above in the price so to not inflate the price for a local buyer who may wish to pick it up. I always use Canada Post - US postal service at the express package level. I do this because like some one said above it requires an adult signature at the delivery point and it usually goes through customs easier-fast. I also have had better luck with the national postal services then the UPS- FedEx's but your mileage may vary here. I also always give the buyer my full name and address for return if something is amiss. Any deviation from this and I state its at the buyers risk for loss or damage (like i'm not going to get fussy on a $20 item but over $100 and i'm wanting insurance). Like others have said its not a done deal until the buyer has the item and is happy its arrived as the state it was agreed on. Always take the return unless agreed prior to the sale. Oh i don't accept PayPal as a form of payment as well i'm not comfortable with another institution having access to my banking. One last thing I never sell unless I have spoken to the buyer by phone as well as email much less issues that way.

I'm honest with condition when I sell and over pack every item. I think most of us are hobbyist and really like to share our hobby and discus our hobby I've met some wonderful audiophiles during the buying-selling process. These are the ones I prefer to sell to people like myself who love the music and hobby not the resellers and people looking to make a buck. If your honest from the start then if shipping issues do arise its easier to come to a solution that satisfies both parties. 

 Note i have used my local UPS store for packing and I find they pack very well here so not all UPS stores are below standard. And bubble wrap is your friend if done right.

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