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My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!

So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:

Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005

With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:

ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)

NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)

Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)

rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)

cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)

parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)

lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)

McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.

butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)

pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.

classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)

Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:



PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass. It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.

That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!


128x128whitecamaross
jetter
1,035 posts
 
Sorry in advance for this long (for me) post and if it seems I am going off thread it was not my intent.  In fact I am having second thoughts about posting it.  WC, if it should not be here give me the word and I will willingly delete it.

Jafox, your reading much more into what I am saying.  I am anything but an experienced audiophile like all of you.  The best I have is a Musetex-Meitner transport/modded DAC, which still sounds better than my newer player.

Say there is a person in front of you singing.  It is being recorded and faithfully made into a CD.  You play the CD on two different cd players or DAC/transports of vastly different price points.  To me, everything about the sound/special cues, etc., should exactly match the original recording/CD without editorializing.  Regardless of whether the budget or high cost unit playback is closest to the original recording/CD, that is the best sounding unit.  The goal of both units should be to reproduce the original sound exactly.  At what price point will the two units achieve this playback accuracy? I have no idea, but suspect its a lot less than the most expensive units sell for. 

Now of course I agree with you that normally the high cost units will sound truer to the source, if not more analogue, but who has or how can this actually be tested to be true?  Then again, what if the more expensive player makes the music sound better than the original recording but the lesser unit is truer to it?

And last, as you mentioned, it may just end up being that WC has some cable/other that is preventing the Lampi from shining.
whitecamaross's avatar
whitecamaross OP
1,499 posts
 
Ok I want to clear the dust here. Technically speaking the Lampizator and Oppo 205 should not sound the same. One is tube based while the other is not. There is no reason WHY they should sound alike and to me it also did not make any sense. I remember when I had Wireworld Platinum 7 speaker cables with platinum interconnects. I was able distinguish the oppo  205 from the Lampizator when I connected both to the ref10. I felt like the lampizator had sharper images and a different presentation.
however,  I  proceeded to borrow a Nordost Odin 1 PC which was already broken in since it was a few years old and connected this to the lampizator and it was jaw dropping what It did. As a matter of fact this was THE BEST I have ever heard the lampizator sound. Soon after being shocked, I decided to purchase a brand new odin 1 pc and odin 1 speaker cables. I placed them in the system and I did not feel as wowed which could have been because they are brand new cables with zero break in. 

I tried to compare the lampizator once again to the oppo now that I had odin 1 cables and I could not detect a difference between both. I mean, if there was a difference, I had to find the right song and work very hard to hear it which SHOULD NOT BE the case. Anyhow, I was confused and I basically blamed the Odin 1 speaker cables because prior to their arrival, my system was sounding amazing with the broken in odin 1 powercord and Platinum 7 speaker cables. This is WHY I sent my Odin1 speaker cables back to my dealer and he is now breaking them in for the next 9-10 days so that I can try again to see if the outcome will be different. In the meantime, while I wait for those cables to be broken in, I bought a bunch of Shunyata alpha cables so I can try and see IF AND MAYBE IF I can hear changes between the Lampizator and Oppo when comparing them. From this,  one of the biggest jaw dropping changes was when I connected my monos to the Denali 6000t yesterday. It was just incredible everything it did for the music. It was bigger sound, less noise, etc, etc. 

 

With that said, I connected everything as follows:

 

Shunyata Alpha speaker cables

Shunyata Alpha xlr from the oppo to the ref10 and from ref10 to the monos

Shunyata Alpha PC on the ref10 connected into the wall

Shunyata Alpha PC on the Denali 6000t( monos are connected to it)

Odin 1 on the Lampizator connected into the Denali

Aftermarket Pc on the Oppo 205 connected into the Denali

Wireworld platinum 8 RCA from Lampizator into the Ref10 (these cables gave spectacular results to me with this dac)

 

I connected both sources into the ref10 and volume matched them. Oppo was totally wireless and lampizator was connected with a wireworld silver 7 ethernet cable. I began to play music through roon so that both players could play the same song at the exactly the same second and went between input 1 and 2 in the ref10 and I could detect the oppo 205 sounding fuller, bigger and crisper.  The oppo had more detail behind the music at times and just sounded more engaging. Did it blow away the lampizator? No it did not. 

My take on this experiment? SYNERGY. The oppo is using a matching alpha interconnect and the lampizator is not. I also believe that the Platinum 7 speaker cables are OUTSTANDING for the lampizator because that silver in those cables just makes more magic come out of the lampizator. I think that the best this dac has sounded was when I had platinum 7 speaker cables (which are basically of the same family of the RCAs being used on the dac) and Odin 1 pc on the dac.

 

This is going to be EXTREMELY interesting when the odin 1 speaker cables return because at that point they will be cooked and should be ready after I play them in my system for 2-3 days so they can settle in. IF they DO NOT impress me upon their return, then it will be just a matter of me NOT LIKING what they are doing with my set up. If  they DO NOT DO what the platinum 7 speaker cables did which was allow me to hear the differences between the lampizator and oppo then this is a testament that the speaker cables are imposing their own sound and not allowing differences to be heard.  Of course, some people can say that I need to use a full Odin1 set up, but that is just an insane proposition in terms of $. For me to buy another 3 odin 1 powercords PLUS odin 1 interconnects would mean I have to spend another 25-30k which I am not willing to do.  

I can already hear an argument coming if the odin 1 speaker cables don’t do it for me upon their return. Wanna know what this argument will be? 

1.    the Nordost camp will argue that I MUST HAVE all odin for me to capitalize on what they do and that mix and matching cables is taking away from the synergy

2.    The Nordost attacker will argue that nordost should be ashamed for charging so much and not easily beating brands costing half as much. 

 

Well, that sums it up from me.  The next few weeks will certainly make my system once again go through changes based on synergy. Everything at this price point is incredible, but it now becomes an art which is called “system matching”.

 

 


zprr
32 posts
 
Very helpful synopsis WC. Thanks for taking that time.
I may have missed, are all the Shunyatas new or used?
whitecamaross's avatar
whitecamaross OP
1,499 posts
 
All Shunyata is new. 
viber6
533 posts
 
WC,
One thing which is clear is the benefits of the Denali, which I have said yields bigger differences than many power chords.  I just have the 6000 which I use for all components, and never had the need for the additional 2000 which is dedicated to the power amps.  I am glad you have confirmed my findings in your system.   Whether tubes or SS, today's best DAC's are converging to similar if not nearly identical sound characteristics.  Even plain cheap CD players aren't a big comedown from SOTA digital systems, unlike the YUGE differences between cheap MM cartridges and the finest MC cartridges.  Your confusion using different cables may reflect the truly small differences between the Oppo and Lampi, which will be true no matter what cables are in the system.  Don't fret and feel you need to spend big bucks on cables.
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