Clearaudio Master Reference vs. Basis Debut V ??

A few people have emailed me on my previous Clearaudio forum comments, so I will share further experiences here.

I have the same gut feeling as Albert on the linear tracking concept. I use the Clearaudio Reference with TQ1 rather than the Master table and arm. And I too had trouble with the TQ1 trackability issue early on as I wrote in other chat forums here.

My experience is that the TQ1 arm just shows poor tracking cartridges a little more than other arms. I had a Benz Glider on a Linn LP12 and even though the Telarc Omnidisc test record showed the Glider to be a mediocre tracking cartridge, it worked fine in a Linn Ittok arm. The Grado Sonata and Sumikos before it all had much better tracking scores. But it was the Glider that I had when I got the TQ1 and thus the trouble started with the new (actually used) Reference/TQ1 setup. I tried some adjustments to the arm height and angle, and this helped, but there were still enough problems with the cartridge getting stuck near the inner-most grooves of LPs to make me try another cartridge.

I then switched to a Koetsu Rosewood Signature and not only did I have a whole new wealth of musicality, the tracking problem was instantly gone! No more getting stuck anywhere in the LPs. I can only assume that the TQ1 is more sensitive and thus more resolving .... and thus more unforgiving to cartridges that have not great tracking.

And I too came very close to going with a Versa Dynamics but now I am grateful I did not. As wonderful as they might have been in their time, I can only imagine the even more added headaches to get one of those up and running ... and on a continuous basis. For me the Clearaudio Reference/TQ1 combination with the Koetsu is so very wonderful. And as complicated as the TQ1 arm assembly is, I see how simple the travel is for the cartridge across an LP and this just makes me feel this is the way to go over a pivotal arm.

I have not heard a head-to-head comparison to any other table/arm combinations. This is always such a difficult thing to do. But what I had with the Glider in the Clearaudio setup was so far above with the Glider in the Linn setup. Resolution is in a different league altogether not to mention incredible low end extension now. It is not easy to know what traits are mainly due to the table or arm's performance but the combination is wonderful.

I too have heard of arm boards for other arms in the Clearaudio tables, but I can only assume synergy exists when you use their arm as well.

And one final note, I did order a plexiglas custom cover for the Reference table to keep out the dust and wondering hands and thus looks so very nice too. Contact me if you'd like to see a picture of this.

John

fbhifi: over the past month, or so, i've spent some time in my audio dealer/close friend's main room listening to the latest CMR with a master tq arm and insider cartridge, all set up by garth leerer, the owner of musical surroundings. (while garth was in town, the CMR also had a graham 2.2 mounted on a separate board; you can mount 3 arms simultaneously on this tt.) i was prepared to be underwhelmed, having heard earlier versions of the top-of-the-line clearaudio tt/arm. boy, was i surprised! this combo produced the best analogue sound i've ever heard, bettering the basis debut V vacuum/graham/koetsu onyx that sat next to it. (i would guess that my dealer, audio unlimited, in denver, is the only place in the us to have both of these rigs in stock.) after an open house to introduce the clearaudioo line, followed by dinner, we broke out a couple of sealed lp's i had traded for equipment, including a japanese remaster of the who's, "tommy." i've heard this recording many times (i have another japanese pressing and several others on vinyl and cd.) i've never heard it sound as it did, tho, played on the CMR. my older son, who was also at this listening session, felt the same (he's a consultant to fm radio stations and several record labels). i've been looking to sell my tnt 3/airtangent combo and replace it with a basis debut V vacuum/graham 2.2 for some time now. not any longer. i'll likely opt for the newest clearaudio tt, the mini-master reference, with the master tq arm, unless i win the lottery, or an unexpectedly large verdict. the mini-master will have one less plinth than the CMR, with 3 motors and the same power control unit as the CMR (the platter and bearing will be the same, i think, as the reference). the new souther-based tq arm is much more robust and dependable than its predecessor. it should not be mated, tho, to anything less than the mini-master. if you wish additional information, send me a private email. -cfb

ps- associated equipment during listening sessions: aesthetix io (latest edition) pre or boulder 201o pre, a pair of accuphase a-50v amps run bridged, avalon eidolon speakers, tara- the one ic's and cables.

CFB- Too bad both tts weren't setup with the same cartridge. The comparison would have be even more enlightening and compelling.
Out of curiousity, how easy was it to readjust the VTA for different LPs with the TQ arm? I've found that I need to fine tune for nearly every LP and the Graham is a dream for this adjustment as it is extremely accurate and repeatable and doesn't change any other arm/cartridge setting. Don't get me wrong, I too have a bias for linear tracking arms. However, the couple that I've had always performed better in theory than in everyday use.
Thanks for sharing your experience with the CMR. I guess I'll always wonder if ....

kelly, i had been talking to John Barnes all last fall about the CMR but he couldn't really say how it compared to the Debut V. i really appreciate finally hearing how the comparison came out.

in the meantime, i have found a Rockport System II Sirius used that i am getting instead of the CMR. I really wanted the vaccuum and linear tracking and had been torn between the CRM and Debut V.

I own a Basis Debut V with vacuum and I agree with that what Jazzhelp did write.
I was looking for years for my final turntable and I checked the Clearaudio, too.
I decided to go for the Basis.The vacuum is great. And everything works perfect, on and on and on.
Never a problem.
The Clearaudio is an old design, the arm, too which was tuned up from Suchy. When it works, it's fine, but I said when ...
The Clearaudio cartridges, specially the Insiders, have a HUGE sale price and a low dealer price.
Every dealer praises them because when selling only one of these, he really makes a lot of profit. And they are NOT reliable, sooner or later one channel stop working, bad design, bended wire which breakes when the needle gets a bit too much pressure.
That was one point which really disturbed, me, too. With this arm there is sooner or later always something happening. Well, I didn't care, I ordered a Graham Arm for my Basis, I use the combo very often and it is like a Mercedes: it's always working perfect.
For me, I did the right decision. I would go this way again, 2 years later.