A tube preamp used with a solid state amp will not produce the same magic.
As what, a solid state preamp with a tube amp? My experience with ss and tube preamps and ss and tube power amps indicate a very different conclusion here. My focus has always been to assemble a system that excelled in the portrayal of space, ambiance and decays; detail and coverage at the frequency extremes were only relevant if I got the 3D issues first. And still today I have not heard any system with a SS preamp that comes close to this area like the few great tube preamps I have owned or compared at dealers. If somebody knows of a ss preamp or line stage that excels here, I'd sure like to hear about it.
The only thing that gives you the tube personality the wonder and magical soundscape not fuzzy warm tone its all about the sound layering image yes tone but not rolled off slow droopy sound. they are the only thing that give you tube sonics that is tube power amps. And no no no for the trillionth time a tube pre is not able to do it.
This is absolute nonsense. And after you have found that most coveted tube amp (with all the glorious harmonic structure and depth) to match your speakers, please drop in a Classe, Spectral, Klyne, Krell or Levinson (Madrigal) line stage. Compare this to something like the Aria WV or Aesthetix Callisto tube line stage and take note that nearly all the magic you paid for with that amp is now gone with any of these ss line stages in the chain.
Upon hearing the ARC SP-8 and later the SP-10 that I purchased in the mid 1980s, I became well aware of the significance that tube preamps play to convey the dimensionality of the music. Even in the mid 80s of a system with a Linn TT, Vandersteen II and an Adcom amp, it was very clear how the SP-10 destroyed the Krell, Klyne and Spectral preamps of that era to simply bring on the portrayal of space. Sure, bringing in the ARC amps at the time, D115 that I heard, brought on greater magic. But putting a ss preamp in the system with the D115 resulted in a most sterile and boring sound. I would have taken the SP-10 and a budget ss amp any day of the week than any ss preamp in its place with a tube amp.
Just as an experiment a couple years ago, I tried my Aesthetix Callisto Sig with one PS, first with my CAT JL-3 amps and then the budget Adcom 555 I bought back in 1987. The CAT amps are expensive for a reason, but the Adcom with the Callisto was more impressive than I expected. The Classe preamp (either DR-5 or 6) I had been auditioning at the time coupled with the CAT amps clearly had far more detail, clarity and extension at the frequency extremes than the Callisto/Adcom, but this latter pair conveyed harmonics and structures the former pair could not match. And it confirmed to me once again how destructive a solid state preamp can be when it comes to the portrayal of space. The speakers were the exceptional Talon Khorus, a far underrated speaker.
A tube preamp with tube PS's is an absolute must in what I need a system to do. The sad commentary is that only a handful of tube preamps out there that I have heard in my system or in direct shootouts at a dealer even remotely came close to the dimensional "magic" often associated with tubes. And sadly, this continues on today. The bottom line is that if you're not hearing the magic that a tube preamp provides, you've got the wrong tube preamp. If you are basing any conclusions on a preamp loaded with stock Sovtek, EH or JJ tubes, coming to any conclusion about the preamp's capability is silly at best. And from my experience, a preamp with a tube regulated/rectified power supply is mandatory to get that last level of 3D performance here.
No hybrids that is a silly joke and the incredibly ridiculously uninformed "a tube any place in the chain will make the system sound the same an all tube system.
Hmmmm........I own an updated Counterpoint NPS400 hybrid amp: 6922 input, tube rectifier and ss output stage. Compared to the tube amps I have owned ARC VT130, Wolcott 220 and CAT JL-3's, while owning the NPS400, the NPS400 is very very impressive in how it handles the 3D....and with a not so easy load like the SoundLab A1.
Mechans: I'd love to put the Aria WV5 XL tube preamp with the Counterpoint NPS400 hybrid amp or a smaller Rowland ss amp against your reference tube amp and any solid state preamp of your choice and compare the result driving anything like Magnepan series 3 or 20, the big SoundLabs or easy speaker loads like a Talon or Proac, etc. But I get to pick the music: piano, acoustic guitar, vocals. And yes, the Roger Waters "Amused to Death" LP would be fine too. Mechans, I think you'd be quite surprised at the results.
First and foremost, the solid state amps lack the three dimensionality of the tube amps I have owned.
I would not argue with this, but who cares unless you have a top-performing tube line stage in the system as well. Without this, your coveted 3D was already out the window.
Sadly, there are far too many tube amps out there that fail the 3D test miserably all on their own. And it is not always due to a mismatch of the amp to the speaker. They are simply bad designs or designed with that intended sonic signature.
There is a lot of gear out there, tube and ss, that get high ratings by the reviewers, that I have dismissed in a matter of seconds because it fails the 3D test. If someone can not experience an incredible level of depth, ambiance and decays, structure, etc., as conveyed through piano, sax, and female voice, in a system with a tube preamp (line stage) and all solid state elsewhere, there's a very good chance they don't have a top-performing preamp that excels in these areas. It's just too easy to blame everything on the remaining solid state gear.
What does everyone else think?
Obviously, quite differently here: If I wanted to keep tubes in my system to a minimum, I'd start at the line stage, then onto the phono stage and/or Dac and then finally the amp(s).
