who wants tone controls on your next preamp?

Herman,
So how does the "Absolute Sound" relate to "Audiophilia"? Not only would the playback, aka stereo systems, have to be ideal but the whole recording process, which is clearly out of the listeners control. I think that is a bit of a stretch! Check-mate!

I am with herman on this point. And it is an often used arguement that we hear differently therefore a standard can't be used for calibrating our listening systems, which is not true.
If my hearing accentuates certain frequencies, say at 2000HZ, therefore making a live trumpet sound more 'brillant' than another might hear it, then when a trumpet is reproduced over my system I would expect that trumpet to also sound 'brillant', if I have set up my system to be faithful to the source played through it. Others listening to my properly set up system, would also recognize the trumpet to sound as they have heard it, even though it might sound differently to them than to me.

How the trumpet is recorded is really irrelevant, since both I and others would be able to recognize if the trumpet sound is different than what is expected.

Salut, Bob P.

Carlos, you are absolutely correct. The recording IS part of the ideal. How could it be any other way? Just because it is out my control does not mean it isn't part of the equation. Given a perfect signal which perfectly encodes the sound of a trumpet an ideal system would decode it and sound exactly like that trumpet. It doesn't matter that I didn't hear the original sound. If I had not I wouldn't be able to tell you if it was exactly like the original, but either it is or it isn't.

When I cook something from a Julia Child recipe does it taste exactly like hers? I have no way to know but just because I have no way to confirm it either way doesn't mean it definitely does not. I would like to think that it does :>)

So once again, yes, there is an absolute, or ideal if you wish. I seriously doubt it can be obtained, but it is there.

check, and mate.
.

Bob P.
"How the trumpet is recorded is really irrelevant" Wow! You know the issue is much deeper than what I have presented above. To truly faithfully reproduced the trumpet in ones own listening room, you would have to recreate the same environmental conditions in which recording was made, down to the same acoustical characteristics and temperature; and this is all on top of having an "ideal" recording chain that is not only neutral but also able to capture all the information necessary for one's sensory system. If you think that this is close to happening with the Audiophile "purist's" approach then I think you have swallowed the oath's hook, bait, and sinker!

Herman,
Do I need to bring "Schrodinger's Uncertainty Principle" into this discussion? I'm trying for your sake not to take the discussion too deep as it will inevitably lose some of the audience. Check-Mate!