Ayon Vs. Audio Research Preamps

Hi Scott, firstly congratulations on your decision to buy the CD-5s. You certainly wont regret that as you're getting a great dac, transport & pre-amp in one package. In regards to my contact, I have spoken directly to Gerhard Hirt at Ayon regarding the Ayon Orbis on several occasions and compiled these responses regarding the Orbis and CD-5s. You can draw your own conclusions..

"The new Orbis will be the next milestone of our preamp history. It is always difficult to give you 100% correct sound description because it depends from so many factors.

Fact is that the Orbis is an ultra new Linestage concept, with an amazing 6H30 circuit ( parallel single-ended design with high current bias point – yes we are talking about a preamp)

Also there is a Re-Generator power supply built in and we are using a special 4 channel volume potentiometer from Japan, custom modified and motorized. As an ayon standard we included special chokes for the power supply.

I dare to say that this preamp doesn’t have any competitor in its class."

"Orbis: it is an analog preamp and not need to bring any update, there will be no any MK II version in the future, the design is done. BTW the Orbis is not yet released.

Actually when you have a CD-5s not need to include an preamp, the CD-5s preamp section is extremely well sounding."

"As you know the preamp section of the CD-5s is very close to any top preamplifier."

"I can tell you that the new coming Orbis will be a new milestone in its preamp class, the design what we using is a bit different from others and we designed without any compromise to get out a new performance standard.

Please know on the preamps side there is since a longer time not really any step ahead , all preamp manufacture in real moved back our using their old concept ( 10 or 20 years old design – just around a new chassis) because the preamp business is not a real business for the bigger manufactures.

But we set up a new reference standard with the Spheris II – it is a design which no others could do it or let’s say nobody would be crazy enough to invest a big amount and research and time to realize a preamp like the Spheris II nowadays.

Even the Orbis is using a bit different technology as the big Spheris, but the Orbis is truly outstanding and we invest a lot of brain to make it happen, and we were crazy enough to invest a lot of time in the Orbis again and even preamp business is not so attractive, for us is more important the result and that we set up a new standard and besides them still a very good price value."

"of course the Orbis is not very dark and very warm sounding but also not too neutral, the Orbis has all magic from a SE tube preamp with a bit warm in the midrange and its huge and holographic sound stage."

"You can be sure that the Orbis will be an improvement against the CD-5s."

Regards,
Melbguy.

Hi Scott, i've done some more research on the Orbis vs CD-5s and have to say i've come to the same conclusion as you. The CD-5s is an amazing preamp. I also found out it's preamp section has similar bandwidth to a CJ Act 2.2 (ie: over 100kHz!). Like you, when I looked at the the significant investment (preamp, high end cable & pc), it just didn't add up. The CD-5s is good enough & is pretty killer. I plan to upgrade my tonearm instead & invest in a high end iso platform...happy days!
Regards,
Melbguy.

The Orbis is a little better % ? perhaps 5%
This pre has an even bigger power supply and the AC regererator built in gives it a clear sonic edge at $13k
it should be better But in the same respect the preamp in the Skylla 2 , or cd5s the dac is world class without any exceptions, the preamp will compete with any $10K
units out there with certaintly. I have freinds in Europe that have throw the book at this gear and the Ayon Never falters.A solid value without any reservation.
My setup BTW Is the Skylla2 using a external Harddrive
to Brystons excellent digital player which has several advantages ,for one it has no moving parts ,all flac files sound better through this player ,also the 3 Big Rcore transformers are not being shared by the player which does give a bit more headroom , and seperation only a few
% points thoughin absolute terms.They are both excellent
I did have the hassle of spending 100 hours over a month to put 500 cds on the External usb drive.I can say though the new HD downloads really add to proof that this is the wave of the future and with a Ipad or Droid you have all album art and your collection at the touch of a button
as well as files with all your favorites done in amoments notice I did have to spend $1500 for a Wreworld Platinum USB, and Digital xlr cable to make the system shine.
The cd5s is a superb machine and is excellent .I was just
making a statement if you are willing to restructure your whole music setup this is an option.

Thanks for your feedback Audioman. Gerhard assured me the Orbis is an excellent design, much different and a superior circuit design from the CD-5s. Have you compared the CD-5s & Orbis side by side? From Gerhard's comments, I would have expected the Orbis to provide a bigger improvement than that. Btw I haven't found a better tube pre under $20k than the Orbis & plan to upgrade to an Orbis later this year. As for HDD based music, yes I see the convenience and agree it's the future of digital audio, but I think if you compared a CD-5s running pre-amp out to an Ayon Orbis vs a server or HDD-based system, there would be no clear advantage to the latter (other than convenience).

Hifimaniac,

I am way late in offering some commentary - my apologies.
At this point, there's about 100 hours on it. The 1st 50 hours were quite low on the wow factor (quoting Darell Sheets...). Had me wondering what I just spent all this dough on. Safe to say shortly thereafter a noticeable front-to-back depth started to reveal itself. What really came out was (is) this extreme attention to the minutia, the little stuff that had me going to the front door to see who was knocking kinda stuff. When the source material hits all the marks - e.g. The Blind Boys of Alabama "Spirit of the Century", the CD5s brings out the kind of emotion that raises the proverbial hair on the back of one's neck. For a 100% tube compliment, bass is certainly not in any short supply. This report must also state that the speaker cables and and interconnects are a large part and parallel the performance attributes of the CD-5s. They are the 10th Anniversary Series Nebula cables from Dynamic Design. Unbelievable. But that's another report. The only and I mean only thing sonically that I'd have me ntion is that the reproduction of those sharp, 90 degree/square-edged reproduction of base drum or more specifically electronic bass beats. I'd describe them as being akin to a 1/2 inch radius. I've been a life-long solid state user and this is my first, real foray into the tube lide. Good examples are found on the first two Moby CD's. It is safe to say this will never leave my possession. It's that good.
Physical Cons:
The remote runs eats batteries once every 3 months. Wayyyy too many buttons for a devoted two-channel prodigy. It also has to re-calibrate almost every time I use it. The remote has to be "read" by the main unit. A little more rare is when taking out a CD that had 4 tracks, for example, when putting a new one in with 8-10 tracks, it still reads only 4 tracks. I am going to write Jerry at Ayon and find out what the Pilot is doing wrong that's likely corrupting the read. One other item is that there's a "Fixed" volume button on the remote. If you're not careful and hit it - volume is set at 0dB. Shocks the hell out of you. Thankfully, my system is robust enough to handle it.
Hope that helps.
Scott