Teres, redpoint or galibier turntable

upgrade to the 2200

I looked at all of the TT you mentioned over a 2 year period. I went with the Galibier. All are excellent tables from respected companies-peoples and you won't go wrong with what ever you choose. I did however feel the Galibier was a little cleaner and simpler in it's design approach. I mated mine with a Moerch DP6 and ZYX Airy 3. Good Luck.

Redpoint and Galibier can cost mucho bucks, but both company's make killer turntables. Galibier is coming out with a new entry level TT called the Serac that sounds very promising at a very good price, but it is not ready yet.

slowhand

all three tables are top notch

I own a Galibier
the wait is well worth it - mine was 5 months

Thom Mackris is a gem and a great guy to work with
and may pipe in here although he's a very busy man

don't expect a production line of Seracs anytime soon
but $5k for a gavia is a steal in the performance level it will take your analog setup to

do a search on galibier here and at vinyl asylum
and look at flyingred's comments
he demo'd teres and galibier
and was very insightful in my decision
dealing with Thom is a true joy
his build quality is second to none

I don't understand Teres' use of wood for tables
but they make premier gear

I couldn't be happier with my gavia

fly up to Denver and visit both Teres and Galibier and hear it for yourself
THom even reimburses money towards airfare

I've owned Basis 1400, 2100 and 2500 tables and still own a Vector tonearm. You really have to move up to at least a 2500 to get proper bass response. If you can find one used that might one way to improve things. The Basis motors are good, but you'll still be using a belt that stretches. The Basis suspension is a very good design and implementation but you'll pay a lot for it and it may not be necessary. You will also be somewhat limited to which tonearms will mount and work well with the Basis tables. Have you looked at the prices of new Basis tables?

For the money, I found the Teres and Galibier to be a much better value if you're buying new. Redpoint has chosen to go with a dealer network so that takes most of the value away. I have no problem with the wooden Teres tables. The dense, exotic hardwoods they use are much different from any hardwood in N. America. I don't think you could go wrong with either of these. It took me a while to decide, even after visiting both Thom and Chris. I eventually went with the Gavia. I've had it almost a year and I'm still very happy with my purchase. Probably the last table I will every buy. I know Teres owners that have had their 'tables for quite a while and they are also very happy with their's.

I love my Gavia and Thom is a pleasure to work with.
I run dual arms and the Gavia is all the table I will ever need.
Daned and Audiotomb have said it well.

Forget about this intermediary stuff, go for it? second mortage? get a Walker Proscenium. That is one super refined table. Lloyd is a really nice guy, give him a call.
No conflict of interest to disclose.

Mechans

not everyone has your or Al Porter's 'cost no object' approach

I'm sure it's well worth it
but about a 6 to 1 cost increase

Sorry to thread jack but I'm also looking at a table in the 5k region and wasn't aware that Red Point had one that cheap.

TW Acustic Raven One? have you considered this?

My short list Basis 2500, Galibier Gavia with Serac platter, TW Acustic Raven One

I'm looking at using a Basis Vector 3/4 any comments on compatibility? I can't afford a Graham Phantom and I understand they use the same armboard

I think the characteristic of the Gavia that pleases me most is how it makes those few less than pristine LPs that I own sound worth listening to. The pops, ticks and crispies are still there but they are more in the background and don't get in the way of the music. I don't quite know what is contributing to this, but I like it a lot.

Cytocycle,

I'm familiar with the Raven only by reputation but I feel I can say that all three of the tables you mention are very solid performers.

An important consideration is how much do you need support from a dealer, other than first setup? If you feel you do have need of such support then Basis or TW may better fit your needs. However, if you're comfortable with 'table set up, are considering spending what a new 2500 costs, and want the best bang for the buck I'd recommend the Gavia with the Gavia platter. BTW, there is really nothing difficult about setting up a Gavia, or Basis for that matter.

I'm not sure what arm board on which table you're referring to? IME, the Graham arms and the Vector use completely different mounting schemes. The Graham's have a flange with a bolt pattern with a large hole in the middle for the tonearm connector to extend downward. The Vector uses a single hole about 1" in diameter to extend the stem of the base into and uses a horizontal set screw to hold VTA.

The multi arm tables mentioned above are great.But consider ultimate expense of two or three seperate arms versus VPI which has quick change of and arm tube for a different cartridge (I use LO MC and higher output MM mono).I know one guy who did both.He bought VPI but then made his own plug in basses that were attached to two arms which had carts matched up to two different stages.Nothing can beat ease of using multi arm but it's the more costly option so figure what you want and use that determinate.For me ultimately less spent on multiple arms meant better stage and Cartridges which IMHO can outweigh deck/arm combo as influencing the sound.
Cheers
Chazz

Dear Gcj123: These could be good options too:
http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgtabl&1190323322

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgtabl&1190084247

Anyway, IMHO in any analog audio system with a decent TT ( like the Basis Signature 2200 ) the phonolinepreamp and a well matched tonearm/cartridge combination are the most important subjects for high quality performance.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.

Hi: These ones could be very good alternatives too:

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgtabl&1190410575

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgtabl&1190410645

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.

As many have said, i think all thne tables are good examples modern TT design working in a musical fashion rather than just modifying or dressing up and old design.

I find Thom from Galibier to be the most thorough and unpretentious of people. His design ideas are very sound and you certainly couldn't go wrong with one of his tables.

You might have to wait as I know he is a busy man.

My views on Galibier and Teres tables have already been quoted here. Having worked with Thom over the last couple of years I would say that he has a better developed sense of what vinyl replay should sound like than anyone else I have come across.

I believe Thom has worked harder than any other table designer to develop a table that does a great job on everything necessary for records to sound great - vibration and resonance control, speed stability, optimized torque, easy geometry/setup adjustment.

I compared the same LP on a Galibier and a Walker at RMAF last year. I didn't hear anything more on the Walker - sure it was good but not better. I'm sure many audiophiles overlook the Galibier line simply because they want/expect to spend more on a top flight table.

The Ravens are competitive, however realize that they are sold through a traditional importer/retailer channel who work the industry marketing models very effectively. I like the Ravens however the aesthetic appeal of the polished aluminum base of the Galibier does more for me than a black lump of plastic.

I agree with previous posts that the Gavia/Triplanar/XV1-S makes poor recordings/pressings sound listenable like nothing else.

In meeting other Galibier owners, I'd say that there's some common ground in terms of independent thought, skepticism for marketing hype and a Salvatore-esque distrust of audio magazine reviews.

>Salvatore-esque distrust of audio magazine reviews<

I read and enjoy Arthur's thoughts and comments but the love affair with his buddy Israel and Coincident products makes him more akin to than different from the magazine reviewers.

IMO

Audiofeil, you mean the COINCIDENT M300B FRANKENSTEIN MK II - THE FINEST AMPLIFIER TO EVER GRACE THIS PLANET!!!!!

Yeah, I have to agree that Salvatore is just as prone to becoming obsessed with a single line of equipment as most audio writers. He's as ga-ga over Coincident as Fremer used to be about all things Musical Fidelity.

I expected this reaction from some audiophiles. Between ignorance, cynicism, egotism and self-interest, it was inevitable. Still, I welcome the opportunity to answer these blatantly unfair insinuations. First charge...

"...The love affair with his buddy Israel and Coincident products makes him more akin to than different from the magazine reviewers. "

Let's compare this statement with the actual facts. This can be verified by going to my website: Recommended Components and "Changes and Updates". The entire 8 year history (1999-2007) is posted there. What will you find?

In those entire 8 years, with Coincident coming out with 20 or so speakers, only one, the Total Victory II, has been added to my Recommended Speakers (Class B), unless you count the Triumphs added to "Entry-Level". Also, I actually demoted the (discontinued) Eclipse series when I recommended the Total Victory II (Class B to Class C). So, just one current Coincident speaker has been "Recommended" in the last 8 years. That's a "Love affair"?! (TAS, then, must be "Tristan and Isolde"!)

The Coincident amplifiers: From 1999 up to February 2007, I recommended one model, and only after making direct comparisons with the ASL Hurricane, and with other audiophiles present. To have ignored what we all clearly heard would have been simply lying. (The Frankenstein is discussed below.)

Cables: Every result, positive and negative, was confirmed by others. Example: the I.C. had more than 20 blind comparisons to the Wireworld Gold Eclipse III, made with customers in 2000. Was I suppose to ignore this also? Further, I posted, 4 years ago now, that all these I.C. results were "outdated", and have even recently removed them entirely. When the Coincident "Extreme" speaker cable was itself outperformed by the Polk, on my SET amplifiers, this was duly noted, and the cables placed in "Lower". Maybe that was just a "one night stand".

Second charge, in "quotes"...

"COINCIDENT M300B FRANKENSTEIN MK II - THE FINEST AMPLIFIER TO EVER GRACE THIS PLANET!!!!!"

This "quote" is a gross exaggeration, and obviously meant to be highly prejudicial. Below is what I actually wrote and posted...

"This is, without a doubt, the finest amplifier, overall, I have ever heard. Two of my associates have also heard this amplifier, in my system, and agree with this opinion and evaluation."

There is a profound difference between these two statements. I spent over two months researching and writing how, and why, I came to this conclusion. Since I had the same opinion earlier, with the Golden Tube Audio 300B (for 11 years!) and the Tektron amplifier modified, I wonder why it's only now that I'm described as going "ga-ga"?

Am I also "ga-ga" with Polk speaker cables, or the Bent Silver transformer, or the ZYX cartridges (and head amp) or the VPI line of turntables, tonearms and cleaning machines? And what about the Forsell turntable and the Avantgarde horn speakers? They're both in Class A, by themselves. Don't forget Wyetech, Tom Tutay, V-Caps, CAT, ASL, Denon, Manley and Atma-sphere!

Comparing me to the main stream commercial audio press is highly ignorant, if not malicious. Their priority is to "sell". My priorities are to enlighten myself and to advise and help others if possible. For instance...

I almost always prominently bring up why a person should NOT purchase something. Just go over all of the caveats and conditions I discuss with the Frankenstein amplifier alone (URL below-Part 3). This is why I also emphasize modifying equipment, if possible, before changing it. It is also why I recommend numerous discontinued components, which can be purchased used, in favor of newer components.

The Golden Tube 300B (modified) was my amplifier (Class A!) "Reference" for 11 years. I never met them, did business with them, and the company went bankrupt many years ago now. Do you think Fremer, Stereophile, TAS, or any of the commercial magazines and writers would have done that? (Where is the potential $$$ upside to them?) If anyone does, they can confidently add "fool" to their self description.

Yours truly, Arthur Salvatore

http://www.high-endaudio.com/RC-Frankenstein.html

I'm keen on trying those amps - seems like a tough thing to do though, even in the same city! I'll have to convince Mr. Blume to lend me his for a day. That's as objective as I can be.

The old "listen for yourself" doesn't often work in practice (no dealer, representation outside of major US metropolitan areas), but in this case, I just might get lucky.

Interesting discussion until it went awry. Let's keep it civil gentlemen.

Just to add my 2c, I'm in general agreement with the others above, the Galibier would have been my top choice, except that I'm not in the US, so it was a question of support for me. I do love the quiet of their tables.

I did get to hear the Teres at the RMAF through a less than pristine setup. The thing that struck me was when wood platter was switched for the acrylic(lead shot), there was a marked difference for the better. The wood platter IMO was coloring the sound making the images woolly.

If the Raven was in the same price range, it should be considered seriously too.

Arthur
Much as I do like reading your thoughts on some issues, they are your opinions in the light of the system which you and your associates use. With the multitude of system variables, not to mention differing room acoustics, a recommendation is only valid in the context in which that recommendation is made.

Arthur,
First, of all name calling and the rest is simply childish and akin to what you accused Fremer of doing to you. If that's the course you choose to pursue, go for it.

Now, if you take the time to read my post more carefully it was footnoted with IMO. Like it or not, my opinions are just as valid as yours. Perhaps more so, given your relationship with certain manufacturers.

Like it or not, your blog contains a disproportionate number of reviews, comments, and referrals regarding your Canadian buddy and his products in the context of all the manufacturers/models possibilities at your disposal.

Those are the facts IMO although you might find them to be a Coincidence.

Hi Cmk. Somewhat of a coincidence that I read a similar response on Arthur’s blog to your experience at the RMAF.

Gcj123, I was considering three or the marques you mention, and had a similar budget. If you do have the time (I did not), I would suggest you try audition and speak directly with the manufacturers. I am sure they all could be very good and certainly worth considering.

Due to time constraints and lack of creditable reviews on all except the VPI, I was reduced to reading owners responses/comments. Reading between the lines of the all the “my table is the best” post, I saw a number of statements that I found deeply troubling.

One comment in particular, made by a few of owners, pertained to the inability of unipivots to match/mate well with low compliance carts. This was very strange to me as my experience with unipivots and low compliance cart over a period of many years was the dead opposite. That coupled with the fact that highly knowledgeable individuals like Mr. v.d. Hull himself state that uni-pivots are recommended for low compliance carts, I was left wondering if their experiences were not down to some characteristic or incompatibility of their turntables.

As I mentioned, I was quite rushed so I did not bother to get to the bottom of this, but I suggest you confirm as you may find your tone arm/cart options limited.

Regards
Paul

Well, that's hard to argue with. It's a well known fact that most of us who have bought Teres/Galibier are not quite right.

I think it is important to understand that there is a difference between saying that a low compliance cartridge works on arm X and saying that that same low compliance cartridge works better on arm Y. Sometimes that little difference doesn't come through.

In my case, all of the comparisons I did with uni-pivot with low compliance cartridges was done on a suspended Basis table long before I bought my Galibier.

YMMV

Hi Paul
I don't disagree with that comment on Arthur's blog.

What I'm trying to say is that any recommendation has to be seen in the light of the system's context, especially in the case of TT>Arm>Cart>Phono and Amp>Speaker. Anyone recommending one element of a system should always list the rest of the system, else it is hard to give credit to that comment.

We often have questions raised like which part is more important, but every part of the chain is important and the music you hear at the end is the result of the sum of the parts. So in the context of an analog playback system, the music is only as good as what the weakest link can reproduce. If you start with 100% at the stylus, and the tonearm resonances removes 10%, you cannot get back that 10% down the chain no matter how hard you try.

Hi Cmk. I am not eluding that you were disagreeing with Arthur’s blog. English is not my first language and sometimes my postings do not reflect the meaning I intended. My apologies.

I was commenting on the fact that coincidentally both you and Arthur share the same 'unpopular' view, and you both posted on the same thread. The board seems to be frequented by what I can only describe as the audiophile equivalent of 'groupies' for some marques and technologies.

Consequently objective views and opinions are few and far between, and sadly, many times said objective opinions are not tolerated well.

I agree that one should approach a system as a whole, and that it is very likely to find a component that works well in one system, to be somewhat disappointing in another. Recommendations made w/o considering the environment are somewhat risky.

Regards
Paul

Dan, my apologies, I should have mentioned my concerns were based mostly on two Teres owner’s posting on VA. The one owner has subsequently sold his Teres and bought a VPI. The post was not aimed at you.

The said gentlemen had, to my knowledge, no preconceived negative bias toward unipivots/low compliance carts, yet had experienced problems. Since I owned and used (quite successfully I might add) the same arm and cartridge combo one of them had on my VPI, the problem could only be a result of bad setup or an incompatibility with table itself. I have no reason to suspect either gent’s ability to achieve a good arm/cart setup.

You have somewhat consistently, demonstrated a high degree of negative bias towards certain technologies, unipivots being one. Some people just don’t like certain things and I most certainly have no issue with that. I therefore did not consider your personal bias as a reflection of some characteristic of your turntable or cartridge (and still do not).

Regards
Paul

No worries, Pauly. My last post should have had a smiley attached since I did mean that as a poke at we who own these subject tables. Myself perhaps being the oddest of the bunch.

As for uni-pivots, I don't really mean to come across as having a completely negative opinion of them. Sorry if I came across that way. I did find the well regarded uni-pivot that I used for a while to have certain limitations under some circumstances. However, under other circumstances I found that uni-pivot very satisfying. Same with suspended tables. It's all about the right combinations.

for the most part all three tables seem to please there respective owners.i have only heard a teres as a friend owns one.it was good enough that i entertained purchasing one myself until a great deal on a vpi swung me that way.i have enjoyed mr.salvatore's blog for quite some time,purchased equipment from him and sought his opinion a few times.when he feels it is time to demote a piece of equipment he does so,regardless of manufacturer.IMO,of course.

Returning to the original poster's request for turntable recommendations, I can offer a couple of comments. Trying to audition turntables can be next to impossible, and very few folks will ever have the opportunity to try different tables of this caliber in their own home prior to making a purchase decision. Plus it always seems that satisfied purchasers are quick to endorse their own table. That suggests that there are many paths to turntable satisfaction, and maybe you can't go wrong with any of the options that the OP has to choose from. Perhaps they are all great tables.

Having said that, being a satisfied Galibier owner myself, I would recommend that you get a Galibier Gavia. It does exceed your $5000 budget, but if there is any flexibility I would go for the greater investment to get the Gavia. Thom Mackris put a lot of effort in developing the graphite top for the current Gavia platter, and the improvement in sound quality it makes is nothing short of amazing. It is easily worth the extra money.

I consider my Gavia a "final" turntable, one which should more than meet my needs for the rest of my listening days. It sounds great, it is 100% reliable, and it doesn't have finicky adjustments. It is a mature design where the kinks have already been worked out.

I can't say how the Galibier Gavia compares sonically to a Teres or Redpoint, since I have not seen, much less heard, either one. For whatever it is worth, I have heard several Platine Verdier tables and a Walker on several occasions, and nothing I heard suggested that either of them sounds better than the Galibier with Triplanar arm. Of course, system setup and system synergies are always critical factors regardless of the turntable choice.

Good luck in your decision.

Dave

I have been looking into replacing my aeries and have done a lot of reading on different turntables.

It looks like Galibier tables went up in price. I think that the Gavia is one to consider. Looking into the Teres line the new to be released 260 model most definitely looks to be highly considered. And the price seems acceptable.

I know what a belt drive table is all about but the new Verus direct drive system is a unknown to me.

Redpoint tables may be out of my price range.

Any comments on these tables is welcome. I did not want to start another thread as this one says it all.

In the 6 months since last post i am hoping for some updated info

thanks all

I am very happy with my galibier gavia. Mine has a gavia platter but you can probably get a serac platter and cut some of the cost. Thom is great to work with and I don't plan on ever buying another turntable.

Mothra: welcome to the club! I consider my Galibier Quattro purchase of a few years ago, to be one of my most prudent, and like you, it will be my last tt. One that will be passed along to my Audiophile son.

Thom was quite helpful before the sale, but more importantly, he was there to hold my hand (so to speak) when I was setting up the table (it was my first tt setup since the 70’s).

Thereafter, he has been more than helpful. Late last year, while conducting business here in Indiana, Thom graciously stopped by with a DIY tweak for my tonearm, confirmed that my setup was quite accurate, and helped fine tune anti-skate, and VTA.

So if you liked the sales support before the sale, you will get the same or better afterwards.

For example, Thom is incorporating upgrades for those of us with previous models. He designed and manufactured a trial / test graphite top plate/matt which to a high degree, replicates the finished product. I just returned the plate a week or so ago. Its effect on the sonics was more than subtle, and I plan on getting the upgrade.

Enjoy your new table....

Mike

I am considering replacing my VPI Aries 2 extended/JMW12.5 arm with a Galibier Serac TT/Artisan arm. Any thoughts or comments would be appreciated. I do notice that you don't see Galibier turntables come up for sale on the used market.

I owned a Basis 2500 for a little over a year. Their spring isolation system didn't work worth a darn and the motor wasn't much better. I now own a Galibier Gavia which is a far better sounding table and waaaay better quality. If it weren't for acrylic, companies like Basis and Clearaudio would be out of business!

Dear Stltrains: Looking to your very nice audio system I can't understand exactly what are you looking for with a TT change.

If you are looking for a sensible quality sound improvement IMHO I think that you can/could do better through a tonearm/cartridge change or through a Phonolinepreamp change. Either of these changes could give you a higher quality improvement over the TT change, even maybe in a different tonearm your cartridge could be better that what you have today.
A change in your Phonolinepreamp can/could give you the highest quality improvement.

So you have some alternatives about all depend what are you looking for.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.

Wait 'til you guys hear the VPI rim drive...

Hello Rauliruegas and thanks for the info. Yes no doubt i have put together a system that can give you hours of musical enjoyment in a short time since my being victimized by Katrina.

But with all due respect dont know if you are being facetious or what but tonearm/cartridge phonoamp/preamp! I could not be more happy with those components. But i think i understand where you are coming from my Aeries at 60 plus pounds is surly a mass loaded turntable, quite and stable. And most would be glad to have one. With out the opportunity to compare it to the mentioned tables in this thread i would not know if its good, better, or worse.

Stringgreen yes the rim drive looks interesting but not available for Aeries tables as of yet. Teres VERUS Direct Coupled Motor system is for use in all tables and that is something i am considering also.

If you are looking for a sensible quality sound improvement IMHO I think that you can/could do better through a tonearm/cartridge change or through a Phonolinepreamp change.

That is in Raul's totally unbiased opinion, of course. :-)

Wait 'til you guys hear the VPI rim drive...

Have you heard the speed stability of a Galiber or Teres tape drive? And, there's no noise at all from the tape drive transmitted through the platter.

Dear Dan: Well IMHO the tonearm/cartridge link and the Phonolinepreamp link in the analog chain not only are a little more important links that the TT it self but I know by several experiences about that those links can give you a greater quality improvement than the TT change alone.

The Stltrains TT is a good one and changing it could give him a very small quality performance improvement than he goes other " road ".

Dear Stltrains, of course that you can put your money where you like but my point of view ( at least is what I almost always do ) is that we take/put our money where it " counts ". My advise about is for the better and in good shape but it is your play. You say that I'm almost obsesive about but till you try it with all respect you can say it for sure. If you ask I can give you a wide explanation of the importance of those links and why you must think on them if you want to really improve your qualite sound reproduction through your system.

Like one Agoner told me: " High end is what you are not what you buy. "

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.

Hello Raul i upgraded my phono amp to a non transformer type due to your recommendation a good while back. Got a good deal on a Tom Evens Groove Plus and after having it a while had the SRX upgrade done. This alone was a huge step up from my 834p.

I thought i was happy using VPIs 10.5 unipivot arm until i got to talking to Mr. Mehran at Sora sound he gave me the opportunity to give Tri Planar a spin, again a serious upgrade indeed. Ditto on going from a DV 20xl to a ZYX UNIverse Xsbl.

Now on my Audio Horizons 2.1 nrb with Siemens CCA tubes all around i am not going to say it was a upgrade to my Nuforce P-9, i prefer 2.1s tube magic in a preamp with my system more than P-9. P-9 is a fine preamp.

I am into this hobby and passion because i love to listen to music. I mean that sincerely my wife is of the same fabric so on week nights when we come home from work we have dinner, and its Rock and Roll until. On weekends well you know.

You wont meet a person who is on a quest to achieve the best music reproduction at home than me. Of coarse money does come into play in that thought. I have been lucky enough to have super people like Mr Mehran, Ty Tyler, John Castler, and a few more who have treated me with there best in equipment and just plain good old friendship. And like i said above when you have to start over from scratch in not only a music system but everything else thats needed in life that friendship is treasured.

Thanks for your time and you to enjoy the music.

Raul, I understand what you meant. I just can't help but tease you because you thing that Stltrains may need to "upgrade" his new Triplanar and relatively new ZYX Universe. I might agree with you about the phono stage but I'm not familiar with the Tom Evans Groove.

I think that what Stltrains is looking for in a table change is better speed control. I know he can get it from these tables mentioned in the subject. He may be able to get it with the new VPI rim drive accessory or maybe even with the new Teres Verus rim drive. But there are many other factors that could be improved over his current table should he choose to do so, IMO.

All,

No doubt this question will resurface in the coming months (heck! I'd be asking it if I were in your position), and those who think that Galibier should be run as a charity will surely give me no small amount of grief for the price increases - even though I've worked hard to hold the line on Gavias and Stelvios for some two years.

Last Friday (Feb. 1), I received a price quote for the raw PVC blanks which are transformed into Serac platters. Their price increased 69% since my last purchase, some 8 months ago. The stainless steel hardware used in turntable assembly reflected increases ranging from a 50% to 80% depending on the part.

I'm working on quantifying aluminum pricing which has historically has been as volatile as soybean futures, while steadily trending upward over the past 4 years. I've been advised by my machinist to expect similar sticker shock for raw aluminum and stainless.

I have no doubts that these increases will affect demand, but given the challenges I've faced in meeting my delivery schedule over the past year, this isn't necessarily a bad thing for those who order. I hate keeping people waiting as much as the fellow on the other side of the transaction hates to wait.

Some manufacturers might feel secure in having a two plus year order backlog, but I consider my speed of delivery over the past year to be my one failing. I'm working on it, but at the same time, the last thing I want to do is to set false expectations.

Cheers,
Thom

Dear Stltrains: I totally understand your point and you already know what I'm talking about and the importance on the subject: you expierence it when you change and up-grade your phono stage and when you change your tonearm, I'm not saying nothing different it is only that IMHO you still can do more through the tonearm/cartridge link or phonolinepreamp that with your TT " road ", that's all.

Anyway, you will make what you think is better for you and the important opinion about it is not the mine but yours because is you who have to live with the audio system everyday, specially on week ends!!!

I like the audio forums ( specially the Agon one ) because all them give us the opportunity to think on subjects that for one reason or another never we imagine that were important, those audio forums help me too to confirm my findings/set-up and to analyze my system from a different point of view and all these facts is what permit that every one of us can/could grow-up on our beloved music " hobby ".

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.

And, there's no noise at all from the tape drive transmitted through the platter.

Perhaps that is the case, but I've certainly heard a tape splice go round the pulley. I don't have an engineering background - how would that splice 'thump' get transmitted to be audible?

Tim

Thom you have a business to run. and i dont think me are any one else here on the gon will hold you responsible for how you have to run Galibier to make a profit.

I was going through the Moody Blues Catalogue tonight and in between A Question of Balance and Every Good Boy i made the bad decision to check this darn thread and well bummer.

For what its worth to me I dont need Charity and if you took it that way sorry. Haven't got any yet. And dont need any. I have a good job that pays very well.

Maybe i am reading to much into your post, as i have had a very long day as well. Vertical transportation is a demanding job.

As Thom says, stainless steel is way up over the past few years and aluminum is following suit - aluminum ingots are up 50% since 2004 and stainless steel is up more than 100%. Kind of surprised by the PVC price jump but small lot buyers can get squeezed by any number of things (example: shipping costs are well over double what they were a couple of years ago).

Thom, non illigitamus carborundum.

Tim, that can happen if the splice is not done correctly. I've heard it myself when a splice began to separate after more than a year of use. When the splice is right there is no thump at all. There is certainly no motor noise transmitted to the platter.

I'm not saying all rim drives are noisy, but that type of drive is susceptible to it even when everything is working as designed.

No tape splice noise here either. If it's done correctly, which ain't too difficult, it's a non-issue.