Do we believe in Machina Dynamics?

Two weeks I tested a SS, wooden and plastic outlet cover plates back to back. Observation = zero difference.

So far from being swept under the carpet, the so-called cover plate tweak is nothing other than crap.
08-07-07: Pauly

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Did you! Hummmm.

How about some facts.

How about telling all of us how you preformed your tests.
*What was the audio equipment you used in your test? Tell us about your system, including the ics and speaker cable used.
*Was there any power conditioners used between the audio equipment and the AC power receptacle/s used for the outlet cover plate experiment?
*Was aftermarket or DIY power cords used on any of the audio equipment plugged into the test recept/cover plate?
*Give us some examples of the music you used for your test.
*What were some of the things, from the music material you selected, did you listen for?

We need to know a little about the 120V ac delivery system you used for your test.

* Dedicated branch circuits?
* Just a regular convenience outlet branch circuit?
* Branch circuit wiring method including material used?
Installed in a metallic raceway with a metallic rough-in box?
NM-B cable, (Romex trade name)? Metal or plastic receptacle rough-in box?
Equipment grounding conductor/s, (safety equipment grounding conductor/s)? Connected to ground in the same panel the the branch circuit/s are fed from?
If not as above....safety equipment ground ran to an isolated outside grounding electrode, (ground rod), that is not connected to the main grounding electrode system of the houses main electrical service?


*What receptacle/s are you using?
Brand? Model number?
Does the receptacle have a steel ferrous back strap or a brass non-ferrous back strap?

* Stainless plates used.
Ferrous (magnetic)?
Non-ferrous?
Was a magnet used to check?
*Please tell us how you experimented with the SS plates?
Here I am assuming you preformed you experiments using both ferrous and non-ferrous SS plates.....
When you experimented with the ferrous SS plate did try the plated not only grounded to the safety ground of the outlet but did you also float the ferrous SS plate above ground? Did you varify the back of the plate was not contacting the recept metallic supporting back strap?

And lastly, and I do not mean this as an insult in any way but it must be asked as it a "control" factor for any listening test. I can only guess your age from reading some of your posts, again only guessing, you are in your middle 60s or older. I have had my hearing tested in the last couple of years. When was your last hearing test?
http://www.fda.gov/fdac/features/2005/305_hear.html

Corrections

When you experimented with the ferrous SS plate did try the plated not only grounded to the safety ground of the outlet but did you also float the ferrous SS plate above ground?

When you experimented with the ferrous SS plate did (you) try the plated not only grounded to the safety ground of the outlet but did you also float the ferrous SS plate above ground?

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And lastly, and I do not mean this as an insult in any way but it must be asked as it a "control" factor for any listening test.

And lastly, and I do not mean this as an insult in any way but it must be asked as it (is) a "control" factor for any listening test.

Jeffreybowman2k I have only had two members from audio forums that thought they had to resort to emailing me at home to settle their differences over a subject matter on a forum board. You were the first of the two. And both of you sadly to say from this forum..... Looking back I wished I had saved your vulgar nasty email to post here. But at the time I took it as only a childish email from someone blowing off steam. Though I did not respond to you with an email I did forward it to Agon for a good laugh. I always wondered if they followed through on it with you.

So in closing I hope you and others will understand why I will not respond directly to your posts here on this thread or any other.

08-12-07: Newbee
Jea48, It's obvious from your questions to Pauly that you have a complete command of the science involving outlet covers - at least I assume that all of the things that you bring up can affect the difference that different outlet covers can introduce into out systems.

Why don't you take a moment and enlighten us on the science involving outlet covers and how all of the variants you bring up can change the differences that they will introduce.

Oh, have you submitted your set up to such rigorous standards? Have you done blind tests? Or do you just hear a difference with your 'dog ears'.
Newbee (System | Reviews | Threads | Answers)

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Newbee, I never expected this type of post from you.
If you would please check the archives here on Agon as well as the archives on AA you will find I have done exactly as you have asked. I also have given testimonials by others on this forum. I have supplied actual posts from a well respected EE and even a well respected former audio equipment designer and manufacture of audio equipment and other products such as ics and pcs just to name a couple. If you would please take the time and read from the archives of AA you will find others that have run their experiments with similar results. You will also find they talk about the differences in sound can depend on the factors I stated in my post to Paul.

Neebee why don't you present your same challenge to Albert Porter, a well respected member of this forum, in regards to his experimenting and findings for outlet cover plates...... I bet you would find the same questions I asked of Paul were part of the experimenting, testing, and findings that entered into his final conclusions.

Newbee, thank you for your response. I realize you came to the party a little late and as such I did not feel that I, needed, or should have to bring you up to speed regarding the on-going pissing contest between Pauly and I.

If you would like to take a little of your time and read the thread where it all started here it is. If you do take the time to read my posts as well as Paul's I think you will find the answers to all your questions. The last page should answers your questions on the why and how a cover plate can affect the sound of an audio system. Be It for the better, or, for the worse. I would like you to post back here with your comments good or bad. I have read many of your posts and I have found you to be a fair man.
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08-12-07: Newbee

Jea48, I guess you can credit my post to ignorance, interest, and a lack of civility that is becoming a far bigger component in posts about tweaks than the tweaks themselves. Your 'hearing' attack on Pauly was just the perverbial straw. There have been far more eggregious comments by others including Pauly and tgb.

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08-07-07: Pauly

Two weeks I tested a SS, wooden and plastic outlet cover plates back to back. Observation = zero difference.

So far from being swept under the carpet, the so-called cover plate tweak is nothing other than crap.
08-07-07: Pauly

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Here is the classic Paul. He ran his experiments, and I believe he really did. And I believe him when he said he did not hear any difference from his system. But Paul couldn't leave it at that, no, because in his tests on his system he didn't hear any difference therefore no one anywhere in the world will hear any difference..... And thus he just had to add the topping.

Quote,

So far from being swept under the carpet, the so-called cover plate tweak is nothing other than crap.

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08-12-07: Newbee

Your 'hearing' attack on Pauly was just the perverbial straw. There have been far more eggregious comments by others including Pauly and tgb.

Don't think I never considered the flack that I might get form that statement. That is why I provided the link.
We all get old..........
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Tbg, as I have said many times in the past I keep an open mind when it comes audio. But with that said it is still tempered with a certain amount of commonsense. MD's phone tweak is a little hard to approach with any believe ability. The only way I would entertain any effect in perception the sound has changed is through the use of subliminal messages hidden within the phone message. Your subconscious is being told you will hear a difference... Would you at least consider that? You also need to think about how most audio equipment is designed, enclosed, housed within a metal case. A metal case that in it's design is to reject RFI as much as possible.
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Do solid state amps have a break in period?

08-30-07: Ojgalli
I would like to hear from someone who has actually taken measurements of a brand new piece of equipment immediately after unpacking and setup. Then follow up with additional measurements taken after precisely 50, 100, 200, and 400 hours of use. Is there a measurable difference? If so, is it enough to be audible? I have found tests results on raw speaker drivers tested in free air. Changes are measurable and significant, however once that driver is put in an enclosure, the properties of the enclosure override any changes in the driver. Tubes change gradually over time, but is that breaking in or wearing out? Capacitors are known to change within the first several hours of operation, but I've not found any other electronics with similar documentation.

We've heard lots of anecdotal claims, but never any hard evidence. Claims for break-in always vary wildly by quality and quantity even with the same piece of equipment.

Here's a quote from a manufacturer's website.

"You hear differently from day to day depending on atmospheric changes and the condition of your sinuses. As you become accustomed to the speakers and the system, you stop listening to them and listen through to the music. When the time comes that you only hear music when you turn the system on, the speakers are broken in, your electronics are broken in and your ears have determined that they really do like what they are hearing."

Or not. I've owned a pair of this manufacturer's speakers. They never got better, only worse, or at least, the time never came when I got past all the distortion to "only hear music."

Why have we never heard someone say the bass got thinner, the soundstage shrunk, the midrange muddled, and the highs became harsh after break-in?
Ojgalli (Threads | Answers)
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Curious how some who have posted here would respond to Mr Ojgalli's post...

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LOL, this thread has more staying power than the Ever-Ready Energizer Bunny.....LOL.....