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Finding the 'weakest link' when upgrading?

Being able to find the weakest link when upgrading is really, really important.
Otherwise a different new component may never really be able to show how it is better. Since the other ’weak’ component(s) is(are) masking the new components better sound.

This is a difficult problem.

My best example is not exactly about the least sound quality, but it may show something about it.
I upgraded a good portion of my equipment all at once when I retired. And I still had in my system an old DAC I bought used. When I received most of the new components (including new preamp, new amp, new speakers and a new turntable and cartridge), I was comparing my old DAC with the new one. And found no sonic difference. I mean I tried every way I could and could not hear any difference between them/ So either I just wasted $25,000 for nothing or?? I was very frustrated.
Anyway, after three weeks I got another new bit which had to be ordered and built
.
When I plugged in the phono box, an epiphany and a flood ot tears.. My $25,000 of new equipment really was better. Since the phono box sounded glorious, thus it made it clear all the rest of the system WAS NOT holding back the new DAC. That new DAC was actually just not any better than my old one. And I returned it.

And unless I just happened to acquire that new phono box a week later, I would have been stumped why the new DAC (which was praised to the skies by both Stereophile and TAS) was not doing better.
I was seriously bummed and confused about wasting a ton of money... until I played the new phono box.

Now it was kind of odd that the two DACs, one, used for $250 )it’ original list price was $1,000) and the other $2,400 and 12 years newer) could sound so alike. But chance happened. (And toss in the official guru magazine praise with it all)
==================================================================

Anyway, how do we find the right part to upgrade? Since making the wrong choice can leave one in the same boat I was in back in my example? (at least until I got the phono box)

I do not have an answer. and I ask.. does anyone?
For me it is just kind of a sixth sense, with little real science to it.

In general I have been kind of lucky.
But how do I know I have managed well?

I do not know.
It has been better more often than not.
(Though I have made a few really terrible choices over many years now and then. Costly choices)

Anyway, my question is how do you make the choice of what to upgrade?
How do you know or decide which is you weakest component?

And do you agree finding the weakest component is really important in the path of upgrading, or one might be making expensive mistakes buying gear, or trying gear? (which may really be great, yet you cannot hear it due to some other weak links in the chain? And though I hate to say so, this weak link may even be cables, or powercords or even the AC from the wall*.

*(but please do not get into a big theory arguments about interconnects and powercords and power conditioners.) Stick to the main topic of knowing how to find the weakest link.
elizabeth
timlub
1,649 posts
 
In My Experience, the components tend to make a difference in the following order:
Speakers
Preamp
Amplifier
Table, Arm, Cartridge
Cables
Dac...... 
I have found that once you get to a certain level in Dacs that there is not near as much difference as in any of the other components..... Maybe cables. 
Yes,  there are differences in Dacs and differences in Cables,  but there is a point where once the reach a certain level,  the differences are minor or a matter of taste.  Maybe the way to put it is..... There is less difference between 2 well designed Dacs at say $500 and $3000 or $4000 that there would be between a $500 Preamp, Amp or speakers vs that $3000 plus component. 

I suspect if I remember right you were using an old Adcom DAC?... Maybe not,  but I suspect that your Dac was of the level that the differences were not night and day.  I have built 3 Dacs with 3 different Dac chips,  they all perform admirably,  they don't sound the same, but they are all very good performers. 
cd318
404 posts
 
Upgrading can be a difficult, expensive, time consuming path which eventually leads you back to where you started from.

However there is a generally accepted hierarchy worth bearing in mind.

The listening room plays a big part. Some rooms are just more lively than others.

The recording / remastering can also make a huge difference. There are an awful lot of digital recordings that have fallen victim to the crude dynamic compression used in making music sound fuller/punchier through small loudspeakers as found in radios, TVs etc

If one HiFi component significantly measures poorly for distortion, it is the loudspeaker. This is where you need to focus your attention because this is the area where everyone can hear differences. Hardly surprising since the sheer variety of design can be bewildering. Different cone materials, cabinet designs, drive unit size, crossover decisions, etc etc. 

The other major area where you can find vast improvements is in the area of vinyl playback. Once you move past something like the Pro-ject Classic to something like the new Technics decks (various 1200s) improvements start to rapidly diminish. There's only so much improvement in speed stability and resonance control and tracking performance that remains possible.

Valve amplification is seen by some as a mere cosmetic difference but it may be one you prefer.

As for the rest, amplifiers, CD players, DACs, cables, etc there is little or no supporting evidence that they yield any sonic differences as the late Peter Aczel told us repeatedly for decades.

It is a shame that you had to find out the truth about DACs for yourself. However it us reassuring that your ears were telling you the truth.









 
pc997
43 posts
 
#1 Speakers
It gets harder after that.
#2 Analog components (power/pre amps, capacitors, tubes - if equipped, power supplies, etc)
#3 Digital components (digital side of DACs, CD transports, network streamers, etc)
#4 Interconnects (not sure if these would make any difference but according to many, they do)

Post removed 
elizabeth OP
6,726 posts
 
The discussion has kind of wandered off 'how to find the weakest link'
(in one's current system, to upgrade etc) to a 'what are the components order of importance.' Which has been discussed many many times in other threads. Though the order of importance does matter greatly in how we decide what should be upgraded next. I would like to stick to how to find the weakest link in setup already in use. I agree it is hard to define, but I am hoping for some insights.

timlub, I sold the Adcom preamp years ago! I bought a Bryston BP-26 almost 8 years ago. (when I also upgraded amp and speakers)
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