2. amps-preamps
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Class D is affordable and sounds as good or better the SS/Valve why buy anything else ?

I have spent a fair amount of my hard earned money on big ticket brand new SS and VT/Valve amplifiers over the years without hesitation, with state of the art 2019 class D amplifiers becoming cheaper and sounding better, i wouldn't join in again.

For older technology amplifiers SS VT/Valve to compete with State of the art class D, Their prices are going up and up.

One example is Pilium Audio from Greece or Bulgaria their Divine Line the prices are all over £100,000 for their pre amps and power amps, I know the UK importer he said they sound OK,

Another example FM Acoustics again up to and over £100,000 for pre and power amps. i have owned FM Acoustics pre and power again their OK,

I am not saying they do not sound good, i am saying why spend this much when state of the art class D probably sounds as good now and can only improve with the GaN capacitors and is nearly up to 100 times cheaper.

Is there still a market for multi thousand £$s SS or VT/Valve amplifiers ?

When class D finally overtakes SS VT/Valves what will people do with their multi thousand £$ amplifiers, keep them knowing there is something better ? Or will we see the market flood with exotic used amplifiers ?

Digital technology is rapidly growing pace and becoming cheaper, with GaN capacitors being introduced the sound is going to get better and better and will slowly or quickly become even more affordable.

If you had 50,000 to spend on an Amplifier, would you buy a high ticket SS amplifier and hope for the best ?

Would you stay safe and go with high ticket valve amp, class D can never match good valves right ?

Or would you sit tight and see how the GaN capacitors can further improve the performance of state of the art class D ?

Please feel free to join in, everybody is welcome, i think its a very delicate/touchy discussion for some people with big bucks invested in older type amplifiers.
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ricevs
190 posts
 

Mike,

Simply not true about you having anything to do with the price of 1200AS2 amps being sold today.  No manufacturer can sell an amp that costs them way less in parts and sell it for more than another amp they sell that has way more money in the parts......especially, when they are showing the insides of their amps and all can see.  The 1200AS2 is a stereo module with built in power supply.  The NC500 is a separate mono output stage that needs a separate custom input stage board and a separate power supply board.  So, a stereo NC500 amp requires 6 boards that cost way, way more than one single 1200AS2 module.  The companies that sell the 1200AS2 are just pricing them according to parts cost.  You had nothing to do with it.....you just want a pat on your back....well, I applaud you for first telling everyone how good they sound.  They are really great amps and especially when tweaked and run mono.  They are not state of the art, no matter what you do to them.  I am pretty sure a pair of AudioNet Heisenberg amps ($105K) would be preferred by most.  However, for $2K....they are mighty fine.

ricevs
190 posts
 

Mike,

Your all in one DAC/amps are only as good as the weakest link.  The stock 1200AS1 or 2 is not state of the art.  And many would prefer a tube sound or whatever sound pleases them.  Having an all in one gives up the whole idea of tweaking fun.  Even if your DAC part is state of the art......your amp is not. Because you have one less interconnect does not mean much at all.  I run a 2 foot hardwired balanced cable from the discrete output stage of my modded Oppo directly to my custom input circuit on my mono 1200AS1 modules.  No preamp, no connectors....pretty darn nice.  Your DAC looks fantastic, but I would not want to be limited to todays stock amp modules. 

miveraaudio
111 posts
 
Regardless on what the cost is to build, if you're not getting a better product for more money it's not worth building. Which is why I went to market with the 1200AS rather than an NC-500 based amp. Even after 8 generations of NC-500 designs. And yes it is true that I set the price bar. I already had over 100 1200AS amps sold before anyone else started selling them. So how could anyone else get away with selling them for much more? 

Anyways I thought you were releasing the best 1200AS based amps ever? I was just reading that you had a showdown at your place against a pair of my Purepower's and yours amps blew them away:

http://tweakaudio.com/EVS-2/EVS_1200_amplifier.html

It would be interesting to hear where you got a pair of Purepower SE's from? Any pictures to share of the showdown? 

plga
44 posts
 
Hello guys
Im not an expert on the field and only had 4 amps in my system:

-Marantz PM7005 SS integrated
-Yaqin MC13S EL34 tube integrated
-Line Magnetic LM-508IA class A 300B tube integrated that could also be used as power amp. A nice and very rewarded amp among audiophiles. 
-Nord NC500DM class D stereo amp with Rev D boards and Sparkos Op Amps. 

Well, I have to say that even the Nord is not yet fully burned, it betters all of my previous amps on every field, including the LM508, wich costs more than twice the Nord, weights 6 times more, consumes much more power, produces much more heat and needs valve replacement ($) from time to time. 

I havent heard multi thousands amps or systems, only once and sounded pretty bad (Bang and Olufsen), but then sound I get now from the Nord is great, and not harsh or lean at all. May be the LM508 sounded a tinny little bit more fulled bodied, but Im sure it was mostly noise as I did some test a few days ago because I founded hard to let the LM508 go, as it cost me pretty expensive for my budget and it was a real nightmare to importe it to my country (Argentina), but, after that test, it was clear to me that the sound was much cleaner, dynamic, holographic and toneful with the Nord. 

A tip to consider. Hulgich Audio, a small speaker factory from Australia, won the best sounding stand on 2017 Melbourne Hifi Show using Nord amps with Rev C boards, wich are worse than Rev D boards, and competing with multi thousand systems. 

Im not saying Nord amps are the best, only that good class D amps can be very good and may be more afordable than similar quality sound class A or AB amps. 

Pedro 

miveraaudio
111 posts
 
Did you compare it to his cheaper 1200AS based amp first? Or did you just assume it was better because of the higher cost? On Audioshark there’s a guy name Marty who has both the Nord NC-500 amp with new rev D buffer along with the Nord 1200AS based amp. He prefers his Nord 1200AS based amp. But he’s probably the only one who’s heard both in the same system.

https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=162114.msg1727311#msg1727311
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