711Similin,
Any update of the shoot out on SACD between the Exemplar and the APL? Did you try to connect APL directly to the power amp during the shoot out. That is what Alex recommended. I have the APL with the latest DAC/volume control mod, and the SACD performance is just freakin' unbelievable. The redbook also bested my Audiomeca Mephisto II and the new Lector CDP.
I am certainly interested in the Exemplar. Price wise, is it comparable to the APL SACD1000? |
Yes, Bwhite, I'm referring to an Empirical Audio Electrocompaniet EMC 1-UP SE which I just sold. |
Tvad?? What is an EA Electro? Are you referring to an Electrocompaniet EMC1? |
84audio you and I should get together one afternoon and listen to my Krell sacd player and your Exemplar..While you are at my place you can hear for your self the full Sistrum system in play with the Caravelle speakers.Tom |
Actually, 711Smilin, I didn't trade up from the Electro to the Exemplar
2900 and make $$$. Considering my initial investment in the Electro
plus the cost of the mods and spider clamp, I came out considerably
behind in terms of $$$. However, the Exemplar is a better value due to
it's phenominal redbook performance combined with its universal
capabilities. Also, the EA Electro still does some things better than the
Exemplar...if you like the slightly warm and analogish Electro signature
sound. |
Hip hip hooray, my 3910 should me done next week, I miss my 2900 already, at least the new owner loves it too. Tvad, nice job making $$$ trading up from the Electro's, huh? Tbg, I don't get it, but you have good suggestions on your tweaks. I also am having john put the siltech and remote in my pre-amp too....I am almost there. |
Exemplar owners...are you leaving the player in "Standby"
mode and powering up with the remote, or are you turning the unit on
and off with the power switch on the player? Does leaving the unit in
"Standby" reduce the life of the tubes? And, if you are
leaving the unit in "Standby", is this because it's
recommended by John Tucker, or something you're doing on your own?
Also, I've noticed a fair amount of high frequency vibration coming from
the transport (I assume). I can feel it when I'm changing interconnects
and I have a slight grip on the back of the unit. I can actually feel the
vibrations in the interconnects themselves. Anyone have a suggestion
for damping these vibrations? |
Hey, everybody with Denon 2900s, unless you have used the D.P. Memory button while hooked up to a tv to turn off the digital and video outputs, you have not heard its potential. With the Exemplar mods, the improvement is breathtaking of about the magnitude of the Siltech wire option. I learned of this from John Tucker and maybe many of you already knew. |
Jules, now that you've teased us re: the HRS review, it'd be fair to provide a few more details about rethinking one's choices about shelving. |
i used the HRS rack for my review of the Denon/Exemplar. A review of teh HRS should appear by week's end. Most of the review is devoted to explaining how resonance control works and why it is valuable. I think the review may encourage you to rethink some choices re: shelving, not because you should only own an HRS -- it's expensive -- but because much of the review discusses issues of resonance control generally. The HRS isolation bases (which are in teh rack) can be bought separately. For anyone who can afford one, I would not hesitate recommending it. It is unrivalled in my experience.
Thanks,
Jules |
My player's on a TG Audio 688 cord, which is fed by a Hydra 4 which is fed by an ErnieM 9AWG Belden Starquad. Once the Exemplar is broken-in, I'll swap in a Michael Wolf source cord to listen for the differences. |
I have had my player since the weekend so it is breaking in. Using a Sistrum opened up the soundstage, but it's very early in the process. What power cord are you using, and how sensitive is the player to different cords?
Thanks |
Glad to hear the Exemplar is doing so well on Redbook! How is it in terms of bass depth/tightness and also image focus? I had read that these were areas of improvement for earlier versions of the Exemplar but that the recent tube power supply mods helped.
By the way, do you also have an external DAC or HT processor? If so, I'd be curious as to whether the Exemplar or APL is a better transport.
Thanks! |
No, I never had the Sistrum, but I did try various points. |
Tbg, I have a Nueance shelf on order, and as I mentioned above I currently have my Exemplar on a Sistrum platform. You say you cannot find anything better than the Neuance. Does this mean you have tried a Sistrum? |
Smilin, neither John nor I understand what is at the root of the breakin, all we know is that it is there.
Many report that the cd is the most improved on the Exemplar. All I know is that I like the improvement in both. I should also say that now with the AudioTop treatment on dvdas, they too are sounding exceptional.
The next thing I am going to suggest is how sensitive the Exemplar is to what is supporting it. It hates ball bearings. I cannot find anything better than the Neuance. |
711Smilin, good to hear your positive report. I received the Exemplar last Friday, so it's going into the fourth day of burn-in on redbook. I have it on a Sistrum platform. I don't know if it's the higher resolution of the player, or the Sistrum or both, but last night I heard the benefits of a recently purchased Hydra 4 after I plugged my amp into the Hydra (the Exemplar was already running from the Hydra). Before that, I was never sure if the conditioner was having a definite and positive effect. Again, I'm not sure where to place the kudos, but it's an improvement I clearly heard. |
The Exemplar is finally burned in for redbook, and is now really strutting its stuff. For redbook, the Exemplar bests the APL for sounstage, Clarity, imaging, and in palying all qualities of cd's. There is a natural smoothness to the exemplar that just sounds right to me. On well recorded cd's, the exemplar just does it better than any other player I have had in my system. SACD so far is another issue, while so far it is real good, the APL seems to put a quality on DSD that is so close to vinyl/tape
it is scary.
A+ rating for Exemplar on Redbbok
SACD may need to burn in those 250 hours too, so thats what I am doing now. More to come....Redbook is AWESOMEon the Exemplar.
Tbg, I do not understand this 250 hour thing, but you are right, so far, that after the burn in, this unit really sings. |
Well, I cannot tell you much yet, as the Exemplar is still burning in. I will say so far I like the APL better as far as the soundstage, musicality(the ability to draw me in), magic midrange(could be WE 300B's/Cardinal X1's), and the seeming hang time of guitar. Now I must say I listen mainly to older Rock/Jazz/Blues....not much classical. The Exemplar seems a bit more extended so far(But I am having Alex build me a 3910 also)the bass is a bit better on the Exemplar. I really cannot give my exact opinion at this time also cause my ear is clogged, and music in general just does not sound right. I will tell you after about 200 hours of burnin the exemplar is picking itself up. Now, for me, I need 2 players, 1 with video for HT/SS and 1 for 2 channel/Tubes, and so far I am not unhappy with either one, but, because of my obsession I will keep on trucking to search for the best under 10K used. |
Any update on the Exemplar 2900 vs APL 1000? |
I noticed that many modded players output higher than the stock player. Why is that? |
I just asked EAD about a 3V input to their unit and got the following reply. Any thoughts?
1) The maximum recommended input on the 8-channel Analog Direct input of the TheaterMaster 8800 is 2.0 Vrms, although hard clipping does not occur until 2.6 Vrms. This is normal behavior for standard line-level signals. I would recommend that you build or have someone build you some L-pad attenuators for all analog channels that exceed 2.0 Vrms. For best performance it is good to keep well below the clipping point.
If you wish to construct L-pads, please remember that the input impedance of the various Analog Direct channels is as follows: LF, RF 10K; all other channels 5 K. You can take advantage of this to simplify your L-pads to a single resistor:
For the LF and RF, place 5K in series with the signal.
For the CT, LS, RS, SUB, LB, RB, place 2.5K in series.
Best type of resistor is nichrome, but metal film should be OK too.
These values will attenuate 3 Vrms to 2 Vrms. If your CD player output is higher, you'll need to calculate some higher values. |
I have been having some problems with my Exemplar 2900. This post is meant in no bad way to John, some of the issues have been caused by my own addition of a SDI output board for outputting video which appears to be causing issues with the standard as well as enhanced ouputs. John has been 100% helpful and has continued to work with me to help solve these issues.
My latest issue (now the valve driven outputs are working fine) is a loud popping/cracking through my speakers, regardless of pre-amp volume.
I wonder if this could be caused by the clipping of my analogue line stage? Its a EAD thetermaster 8800Pro.
I began to wonder about this because of the comment in the six moons review which stated, "The output tubes are Amperex 7062s, which increase RedBook output to 3 volts, 50% higher than the industry standard."
If I run this input into the direct analogue inputs which are passed unprocessed to the ouputs I get this bad popping/cracking sound. If I run the inputs to the EAD re-digitising inputs I get a much less muted, almost clipping pf the peaks type sound.
Has anybody else had any issues with clipping of linestages, especially EAD ones?
Once again, I just want to reiterate than Johns support has been first rate and I wouldnt hesitate to do business with him again. |
I found there to be a small but noticeable improvment overall with the display and video circuitry off. I use this mode for critical listening sessions. |
Tbg, I have made no claims. My APL is fully broken in, The Exemplar has had about 24 hours of break in, certainly not enough to pass any judgement. When I had the exemplar from Ric in my system, comparing to the APL(before the new chip/volume control mod)I had felt the exemplar bested the APL in redbook/and the APL won with SACD, for me in my system. Upon my decision, I paid John to build me the Exemplar with the latest siltech upgrade cause I loved the sound, also I intended to use the exemplar in both my HT/and 2 channel, along with either the APL/or Dan wright.
Upon seeing the 3910, with the higher grade video, and the HDCD capability I have decided that when I break these units in, I will most probably sell one or both and upgrade to the 3910's. I am an audionut, yes I am.
I believe each modder has their own ditinct sonic signature of which there will NEVER be an unequivocable best unit. This is a result of each individual having their own sonic signiture to their own liking. As far as I can tell so far, they are all GREAT. I just dunno where this journey will lead to, do you? I am glad you have found your audio nirvana with the Exemplar, at least you can be set for a while now. Just wait till you here the NEW denons(3910)after they mod them....I know for myself I have the full remaster collection of the Grateful Dead, BUT they only sound GREAT in HDCD, and right now, my denon 2900, nor my sacd 1000 with play SACD/whats a man to do? |
I heard no difference when I shut off the video. I do hear a most modest improvement with the display off. |
in my review I followed John's instructions on setting up for two channel listening which included shutting off video features. Setting the machine up correctly made a substantial difference in performance.
Jules |
Are you guys using the direct digital switch? This shuts off the video and display features for a supposed increase in performance. Can anyone tell a difference? |
My experience with my Exemplar Denon, in my system, is very similar to the 6 moons review. SACD is outstanding. Redbook is nearly, if not, as good as SACD. and DVD-A is also outstanding.
My long hunt for digital I can live with is over. Good Luck, |
Hi guys,
My instinct is to stay out of this, certainly on the merits. I have had Dan mod a Sony SCD 9000 in the past and he too did a wonderful job. I have owned nothing from Alex or from Allen Wright. I don't like to make comparisons in my reviews unless I have all the products in house and under conditions that allows each to perform to its best.
I don't worry about the Best or Better. I wonder about how good the component sounds in my system.
More than that, I write my reviews with one purpose primarily in mind and that is to provide useful and illuminating information that is helpful to potential consumers and fair to manufacturers and designers.
In the Spring I will be reviewing the Exemplar Horns. Now that's something I look forward to!
Have fun and try not to take it so seriously that you lose sight of the potential for joy in all this.
Cheers, and keep reading 6moons. We're working pretty hard and having a hell of a good time -- even if my 'beat' is the usually unobtainable in tube electronics and turntables.
I don't know that the Exemplar is the best, but I do know it made me feel good about the possibilities of digital at reasonable cost.
What I would like to know is whether my particularly positive experience with DVD-A is common or unusual
Jules
Jules |
At VSAC I heard all three plus the outstanding Allen Wright unit. Conditions were deplorable. I already had the Exemplar in its first version. I bought an Allen Wright unit shortly afterwards. All of this is a moving target as moders are not stuck in place. But the latest Exemplar is so superior to many other exceptional units I have heard, that I doubt if Alex's, Dan's, or Allen's unit can outperform it. Sorry, smilin, but it is no more an "unwarranted claims" for me to make it at this time than for you to do so later. |
Thanks - just knowing the websites and names are a help. I'm in South Denver area - if anyone would be enough of a sport to contact me about a possible mod-to-stock Denon comparo someday that would be cool. |
Bbeezley, you're going to get several opinions, and you'll never get a consensus of which is best. I'd suggest contacting each of the following modders by phone, ask them questions, and decide for yourself. Perhaps there's someone in your area who owns one of the modded players. Bottom line, I don't think you'll be disappointed with any machine from the following modders: Dan Wright http://www.Modwright.comAlex Peychev http://www.aplhifi.comJohn Tucker http://www.exemplaraudio.com |
I just bought a 3910 and intend to have it modded. I've read archives but the mod people are often referred to by first name and I can't get straight who is who. I believe I have read of at least 4 different companies. It seems that every customer is wildly happy with their product no matter who did what mod.
Can anyone offer a brief overview of who runs which of the major Denon-modding companies, and any distinguishing characteristics or credentials that could be a starting point for trying to decide who to go with? I'm attracted to the idea of a tube mod - do only some offer that?
Thanks |
Right now I have the APL modded SACD 1000 AND the exemplar, as of today the APL wins. I am sure Dans mods are excellent too. All will depend on YOUR EARS,not a reviewers. Plus you need to listen to your own music(tastes, likes)with all ancillary equipment...amps/speakers/wire/room. I understand my Exemplar is not broken in yet, but Tbg, do not make unwarranted claims, ie:the exemplar is best. I understand you have had other highend players in you system. I have them currently together, a/b'ing thru Johns pre-amp. I can only say what I hear. IMHO I cannot pass judgement yet. In time I will, and I also will have DAN do a mod for me too. BTW if any of you guys want the denon 3910 I have a GREAT source for it, as all three guys will be modding this player. This is a favor AND a great deal. |
Hey, we're not going to get into a Modwright vs. Exemplar battle here are we? I'm certain both are excellent. Dan's Sony 999ES has received a glowing review on the "Stereo Times" website, and having owned one of Dan's machines, I can tell you he does stunningly good work. A machine from either modder would make the buyer quite happy. |
Tombowlus, you should listen to the Exemplar. |
Dan Wright has been mentioned briefly above, but I'd just like to reiterate that ModWright should definitely be considered as well as Exemplar when it comes to modding. I have a 5900 (which also plays HDCD) with Dan's Universal Truth Tube mods (and some other mods), and it has exceeded my every expectation. |
Here is Jules Coleman's reply to my question regarding the static issue: you can hear the static, but it is of short duration, when you press buttons to skip tracks or to start the machine going. you don't hear it once a disk is playing. it is just a noise associated with mechanical use. once the disk plays, there is dead silence. He also said the Exemplar is the best mod he has heard. |
Also, I recently cleaned the tubes and sockets within the Exemplar with the AudioTop contact cleaner. The improvement is at least of the magnitude of the use of Siltech wire. This stuff maybe from an alien culture given how much better it is than any other cleaners I have used. |
It really is more of a connection pop or snap, when the unit recognizes the type of disk. It is never there with the music. |
what about the static issue mentioned in the 6moons review? Is there a lot of it, and when do you hear it. |
Boy, John will get no sleep now. http://6moons.com/audioreviews/exemplar/denon.html |
Please don't say anything for at least a week and keep it running 24/7. |
Well,
I finally received mine today. It sounds really good out of the box. I haven't really had much time to sit down to listen today. I did open it up and it looked really well thought out and quality of workmanship is excellent. I am going to run it in for a few days and i'll post what i think. |
I just recieved the exemplar, I am going home to check it out...ttyl |
I purchased a 3910 three days ago & have been breaking it in 24 hours a day. Admittedly I haven't spent much time in the past several months with digital gear - so I've lost my digital-bearing slightly - but I must tell you, the stock Denon sounds pretty decent (after a bit of break-in).
I'm sure the Compass Lake ICs don't hurt but the Denon is sounding respectable even when the stock power cord is in use.
I'm pretty excited about the potential for this unit once the Exemplar mods are ready. |
smilin, I find it a common experience that components sound quite good initially only to loose their luster and sound poorly for some time. This is the case with the Exemplar also. I suspect it has to do with forming the capacitors and cables, but it may also be getting the old tubes up to performance levels. Solid state gear shows this less than tubes, but it is still there.
The AudioTop contact treatment must improve the conductivity through the tube pins. It makes the unit sound more immediate and dynamic. The ambience of the recording venue are clearly reproduced making you feel as though you were there. |
The Audiotop cleaners are made in Switzerland. If you look up the name in the AudiogoN Manufacturer list you will find the website link for more information. |
Tbg, what is this AudioTop contact treatment? And please do explain the improvement, along with explaining why the Exemplar sounds only pretty good at first, than bad, than great. I really do not understand. |
