The "classic rock" era was a great time for white guys singing the blues and hippies singing bout peace and love.
Also a time when electronic instruments, guitars and keyboards mainly, came on board and broadened the horizons immensely from prior music.
Other than that, nothing special compared to any other period really IMHO.
Musics been mostly evolutionary rather than revolutionary since. Maybe that's part of why it does not seem as special these days.
Think about today's pop/rock music compared to 40 years ago then pop/rock music of 40 years ago compared to what was around 40 years before that. Which period saw more change?
The thing that's out there now that has potential for as big a revolution musically for average white guys down the road as classic rock/pop had back in the day is the "world music" trend. That is where things can still be shaken up in a big way for the typical US pop/rock groupie. But it will require a willingness to explore beyond the fairly easy to relate to vibe of the blues. |
40 years ago it was pretty much all about exploration. Where is the new frontier these days?
Listening to some Johnny Hartman, damn those Beatles for taking music over! |
YEs, Rolling Stone Magazine is still a good place for aging hippies and the lot to keep up to date with new music that they might like. Good recommendation! |
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Will people still be drinking those same old bottles of wine 100 years from now? |
It'll probably be worth a lot as an antique or relic. I wouldn't drink it. |
Oh, well that's very different!
I'm sure some will still be drinking some of today's bottles in 300 years, but there will hopefully be way more to chose from by then than now. |
There might even still be a "hippie" or two around that thinks the only good music out there is still classic rock from the 1960s and 1970s, just like there are still some out there today that levitate towards music from the middle ages, like Ritchie Blackmore and his lovely wife. I am a bit of a lute fan myself even.... |
I think I would levitate that way even more for Candice Night if I could. |
Assuming what was said above to the effect of simple melodies being the best (which I agree with), that bodes well for music both now and in the future, plus creative drugs most likely need not play a major role.
There will always be those who are more adventurous as well, but they will likely meet with smaller (though not necessarily less enthusiastic)fan bases. That is even the case today with the more adventurous works and artists from the glory days of what is referred to as "classic rock". These guys (and gals) are the ones that will continue to draw the strongest opinions as well, like "this is the best thing since sliced bread", or "that sucks", whatever.
Its still a small % of the population that are even able to draw a meaningful conclusion regarding many of the best but perhaps lesser known, more esoteric works of even the classical masters.
And so it goes. We each can only participate and observe from our own always limited perspectives. |
I'd be willing to bet that if some of those who are currently down on most new music would ramp up their "creative drug" input to their adolescent and early adult levels, their perspectives might change and perhaps even broaden. |
Actusreus,
No argument, but consider the music prior to Elvis and The BEatles to that after. Big difference! I was born in 1959 (13 years older than you). Music changed in big ways over the next two decades from the time I was born. To some extent during the 80s and 90's and later as well, but to a much lesser degree in terms of music popular with kids and younger adults of the time. Many tend to like a lot of older rock/pop music just like classical lovers still listen to Bach and Mozart as well as newer composers. There is love for the genre of classical music, much like for rock music. But most new music out there today is no longer rock/pop, a lot of that has been done and yes hard to top, though it still happens. Its when one considers newer musical forms and genres that the argument for new music changes, much like rock and roll changed the argument for what comprised good music for many back in those days. Its hard to compare apples and oranges, but does not mean either sucks. |
I suppose its a glass half full or glass half empty type of thing. I will chose the glass half full perspective. Would a full glass really be any better? I can only drink so much at a time. After that, its not as enjoyable. And there are plenty of old favorites out there to always fall back on as needed. If I'm around for another twenty years or so, there will surely be even more. |
"I did prefer the time when all I seemed to need was one or two "top 40" stations, but I was young and naive and settled for some things I would not listen to now."
Yes, I am fond of those days as well.
Being the techn-geek I was though, when I got my first real stereo in ~ 1972 (a $200 Sanyo compact with radio, phono and cassette all in one, like were very popular in those days), I spent countless hours trying to rig better antennas in order to pick up faint or distant stations from Philly, Baltimore, DC or wherever I might find better in hopes of finding more good stations and music to listen to. IT worked to some degree but many were quite noisy.
Jump to today....more music available both current and past at my fingertips with very good fidelity than anyone could possibly listen to in their lifetime.
AH, the good old days when life was simple and imperfect yet everything still sounded fresh and new. Is it me? OR is it Memorex? |
" I can't listen to the same stuff thousands of times any longer. "
I'm with Don on this, though I find I am able to listen to the same old stuff some more, as long as there is other newer stuff to listen to as well. Newer means new to me, it could be old stuff I have not listened to before, or new. Lots of good stuff in both categories. Doesn't matter when it was made. I either like something or I do not. I find something to like in most everything I listen to. My listening time is limited, so I try to listen to as many different things as possible, mixing in the stuff I know and already like as needed. Breaking any habits of always just listening to the same old "favorites" helps find new ones. |
GEtting a good internet radio feed into my system was probably the best thing I ever did to help me break my ruts of listening mostly only to old favorites and giving "new" stuff a chance. It can be a mind opening experience.
Soon after I added my own music server and started buying "new" CDs again to build up my own collection and I listen to my own personal "Mapman Radio" station in essence now. Its format is eclectic with lots of variety.
Many artists and recordings featured from old 78's from the 1920s to more exclusively modern acts, including some newer pop/rock acts like:
Muse, Arcade Fire, Fleet Foxes, Band of Horses, Gorillaz, Kelly Clarkson, Flo-Rida, Eminem, Ne-Yo, Sean Paul, Radiohead, Broken Bells, The Black Keys, Alabama Shakes, Porcupine Tree, Dream Theater, The Mars Volta, Massive Attack, Motorhead, Killswitch Engage, The Decemberists....many more with new stuff added to the rotation all the time.
Access to Mapman Radio is limited to my houses Wifi by invitation only. :^) |
"But at the end of the day, filet Mignon is still filet Mignon and McDonald's is still McDonald's, and the fact that you no longer want to eat the former can't change it. "
Yeah, but it still may still taste pretty darn good when that is what you are hungry for.
All music is low fat, low sugar, low salt and no carbohydrates last time I checked, so no physical harm is likely. :^) |
So here's a different spin.
Let's assume most or all new music does suck.
Then let's assume that those reading this are music lovers.
Conclusion: we're all doomed!
Thanks! I feel a whole lot better now!!!!! |
All rock music and mucb of pop is part of youth culture. Its not reasonble for old guys to ass judgement condemning modern rock and pol. Its not our music for the most part. So you can pasx judgement and say it mostly sucks but it really does nof matter. So have at it. Jusf remember you are not the target audience like you were back in your youth when all that truly great rock music was made by those more your peers. |
Basie last recording from the 80's "Fancy Pants" is reference material in regards to sound quality + good performance as well.
Many newer albums by newer groups are very well recorded. I find few CDs that I want to like but cannot because of poor sound these days. It does happen occasionally though. |
"There is plenty of music being produced every year that is as good or even better than the Beatles ,Stones,Who, etc... IMHO "
IF those are one's reference artists, it's no surprise no others would be deemed as good or better.
Doesn't mean those who came after suck though. Maybe only in comparison?
WHere are the new BEatles?
Stones?
Zeppelin?
Bach?
Chuck Berry?
Johnny Cash?
Those ships have sailed. What's come after may bear some comparison but is not the same.
So if your looking for new artists to fill the void left by other older classic acts, you will have a long wait.
Doesn;t mean the new music sucks though. Just more of a challenge than ever though perhaps to tread new ground. Many do it quite well if perhaps not to the same extent or scale or volume of output as some big names from the past.
THere will probably be lots of BEatles lovers 100 years from now, just like there are many who still appreciate Bach or Mozart today, but I doubt they will still be first in most peoples hearts by then. |
"Aren't you forgetting something?"
Where's the new Dylan???? |
What did I forget?
All I am saying is that more recent artists will probably be most popular 1000 years from now just like they are today. Recent artists relative to ones youth or formative stages of life that is. Not to say the "classic" acts might still not be popular to some extent as well. Rock/pop is only one genre to consider. THere will be other newer ones that will seem to be much fresher in 100 years as well, I would predict. Time will tell what those will be as the generations pass. |
"What if I didn't have my old 'reference' points for comparison?"
I agree that not holding new music you hear up to comparison with one's existing musical reference points is key to being able to gain an appreciation for new music. Newer artists usually are influenced by older artists, but each is unique. Art is often about creativity and exploration, not fitting some existing mold.
I recall the allmusic.com site lists influence relationships among artists, which can be helpful for finding new acts one might like based on current likes and dislikes.
Maybe part of the problem with learning to like new music is that it involves some work perhaps on the listener's part to break their "mold". That may not appeal to all. That's fine, but I just do not see any value in asserting most new music sucks and then arguing about it. It's obviously a personal opinion that is of little value to others, though one is entitled to express their opinion, whatever it may be. |
One thing for sure about most modern music compared to 60s and 70s classic rock, psychedelic is definitely not "in" these days. Not very groovy, baby..... |
+++Rockadanny
No doubt there has never been a better time to be a music lover than today and a big part of it is the variety of and accessibility to new music. |
Well, I do miss being able to go into a record store like that and look at records, but once CDs did records in, there was really not much to look at much anymore. Now the Internet has put those days to rest for good, for the most part, FBOFW. THough it does seem that most metro areas still have a couple of specialty record/music shops around, so not totally extinct quite yet. There are a few near me, but gotta admit I only get there once in a blue moon these days and buy most of my new music via internet. |
I have fond nostalgic memories of record stores as well, but Rock is right. There is no way one can compare what is at one's disposal today in terms of music resources to back then. It's night and day.
Nostalgia can can clearly be a factor regarding why old music has more appeal than the new for so many. There were experiences attached to that music for many as well as the music itself.
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Well, it was a very informative thread I thought regardless. |
If I could have my way, I would bring back all the record stores I have frequented over the years and they and the ones still around would all thrive.
But, if I had to chose between how I found and accessed new music years ago to what can be done today, I'm afraid I would have to let the fond memories go and move forward.
There is one thing from the past I have mentioned in older threads that I would bring back. The more I think about it, the more I think it could be a viable business proposition to actually do it now more than ever.
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Here's the current top new CD list on Radio Paradise.
Alt-J - An Awesome Wave
2. The National - Trouble Will Find Me
3. Woodkid - The Golden Age
4. Patty Griffin - American Kid
5. Owiny Sigoma Band - Power Punch
6. Daughter - If You Leave
7. I Am Kloot - Let It All In
8. The Boxer Rebellion - Promises
9. Calexico - Algiers
10. Beth Orton - Sugaring Season
11. Harry Manx - Om Suite Ohm
12. Ludovico Einaudi - In a Time Lapse
13. Sarah Blasko - I Awake
14. Sinkane - Mars
15. Gabrielle Aplin - English Rain
16. Neil Halstead - Palindrome Hunches
17. Vel Indica - Turn Off Your Devices
18. The Spring Standards - Yellow/Gold
19. Caro Emerald - The Shocking Miss Emerald
20. Ben Howard - Every Kingdom
21. Bat for Lashes - The Haunted Man
22. Grizzly Bear - Shields
23. thenewno2 - thefearofmissingout
24. Serafina Steer - The Moths Are Real
25. Shook Twins - Window
26. Black Rebel Motorcycle Club - Specter At The Feast
27. Various Artists - Beautiful Creatures OST
28. The Smashing Pumpkins - Oceania
29. Night Beds - Country Sleep
30. KT Tunstall - Invisible Empire // Crescent Moon |
And the top classic songs:
Jimi Hendrix - All Along The Watchtower (9.651)
2. The Beatles - A Day In The Life (9.65)
3. Pink Floyd - Wish You Were Here (9.639)
4. Beethoven - Moonlight Sonata (9.637)
5. Pink Floyd - Shine On You Crazy Diamond (9.577)
6. J.S. Bach - Toccata in D minor (9.575)
7. Pink Floyd - Echoes (9.563)
8. Beethoven - Symphony No.5 - Allegro Con Brio (9.556)
9. Dave Brubeck Quartet - Take Five (9.55)
10. Vivaldi - The 4 Seasons: Summer (9.531)
11. Pink Floyd - Time (9.525)
12. The Beatles - You Never Give Me/The End (9.518)
13. Jimi Hendrix - Little Wing (9.514)
14. Pink Floyd - Us & Them -> Eclipse (9.508)
15. Mozart - Symphony No. 40 - Molto Allegro (9.468)
16. Simon & Garfunkel - The Sound of Silence (9.467)
17. Jimi Hendrix - Little Wing (live) (9.466)
18. The Beatles - While My Guitar Gently Weeps (9.465)
19. Simon & Garfunkel - The Boxer (9.447)
20. Pink Floyd - Comfortably Numb (9.435)
21. The Beatles - Here Comes The Sun (9.433)
22. Jimi Hendrix - Purple Haze (9.43)
23. Otis Redding - (Sittin' On) The Dock of the Bay (9.402)
24. The Beatles - Let It Be (9.394)
25. Jimi Hendrix - Voodoo Child (Slight Return) (9.393)
26. Beethoven - Für Elise (9.385)
27. Etta James - At Last (9.38)
28. Louis Armstrong - What A Wonderful World (9.377)
29. Benny Goodman - Sing, Sing, Sing (9.349)
30. Rolling Stones - Gimme Shelter (9.326)
31. The Beatles - Norwegian Wood (This Bird Has Flown) (9.32)
32. Jimi Hendrix - The Wind Cries Mary (9.312)
33. Mozart - Eine Kleine Nachtmusik - Allegro (9.306)
34. The Beatles - Eleanor Rigby (9.295)
35. Rolling Stones - Paint It Black (9.289)
36. Jimi Hendrix - Red House (9.281)
37. The Beatles - You've Got To Hide Your Love Away (9.279)
38. John Lennon - Imagine (9.277)
39. Simon & Garfunkel - America (9.275)
40. The Beatles - Strawberry Fields Forever (9.27)
41. The Who - Baba O'Riley (9.267)
42. Pink Floyd - The Great Gig In The Sky (9.265)
43. Led Zeppelin - Babe I'm Gonna Leave You (9.26)
44. The Beatles - In My Life (9.255)
45. B.B. King - The Thrill Is Gone (9.248)
46. The Beatles - Blackbird (9.243)
47. Johann Sebastian Bach - Violin Concerto No.4 In E, Adagio (9.235)
48. Antonio Vivaldi - The 4 Seasons - Summer - Allegro Non Molto (9.223)
49. Van Morrison - Into The Mystic (9.222)
50. Otis Redding - I've Been Loving You Too Long (9.217)
51. Erik Satie - Gnossienne No1 (9.206)
52. Duke Ellington - Stormy Weather (9.204)
53. Vince Guaraldi Trio - Linus and Lucy (9.202)
54. Led Zeppelin - Ramble On (9.195)
55. Johnny Cash - Folsom Prison Blues (9.18)
56. Ray Charles - Hit The Road Jack (9.139)
57. Chuck Berry - Johnny B. Goode (9.135)
58. Sam Cooke - A Change is Gonna Come (9.13)
59. Patsy Cline - Crazy (9.127)
60. Edvard Grieg - Hall of the Mountain King (9.122) |
Here's one of the few newer songs I ranked a 10 on Radio Paradise. I tend to not do this in general preferring to save 10s for songs that have proved their worth over time as classics, but this is perhaps one of the most beautiful yet chilling and sad tunes ever:
Porcupine Tree - Sentimental
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Track 4 from "Fear of a Blank Planet" (2007)
Never want to be old
And I don't want dependence
It's no fun to be told
That you can't blame your parents anymore
I'm finding it hard
To hang from a star
I don't want to be...
Never want to be old
Sullen and bored the kids stay
And in this way wish away each day
Stoned in the mall the kids play
And in this way wish away each day
I don't really know
If I care what is normal
And I'm not really sure
If the pills I've been taking are helping
I've wasted my life
And I'm hurting inside
I don't really know
And I'm not really sure...
Sullen and bored the kids stay
And in this way wish away each day
Stoned in the mall the kids play
And in this way wish away each day
Sullen and bored the kids stay
And in this way wish away each day
Stoned in the mall the kids play
And in this way wish away each day |
Here is my list of top rated songs on Radio Paradise. Anything that I like a lot typically gets a 7 or better.
10 - King Crimson - Epitaph
10 - Traveling Wilburys - End Of The Line
10 - The Beatles - When I'm Sixty-four
10 - The Beatles - In My Life
10 - Peter Gabriel - Mercy Street
10 - The Beatles - You Never Give Me/The End
10 - Simon & Garfunkel - The Boxer
10 - Grateful Dead - Ripple
10 - Elton John - Rocket Man
10 - Erik Satie - Gymnopedie No. 1
10 - Moody Blues - Gypsy (of a strange and distant time)
10 - Neil Young - Helpless
10 - Ray Charles - I've Got a Woman
10 - Aaron Copland - Fanfare for the Common Man
10 - John Coltrane - Naima
10 - Temptations - Papa Was a Rolling Stone
10 - Duke Ellington - Sassy
10 - Paul Simon - Late In The Evening
10 - J.S. Bach - Toccata in D minor
10 - King Crimson - One Time
10 - David Bowie - Space Oddity
10 - Porcupine Tree - Sentimental
9 - Johnny Cash - The Mercy Seat
9 - Blind Melon - No Rain
9 - Peter Gabriel - Growing Up
9 - Chantays - Pipeline
9 - The Beatles - Hey Bulldog
9 - The Beatles - Revolution 1
9 - The Pretenders - Back on the Chain Gang (live)
9 - Bob Dylan - Everything is Broken
9 - Doc Watson & David Grisman - Summertime
9 - Moody Blues - Blue World
8 - Porcupine Tree - My Ashes
8 - Rodrigo y Gabriela - Stairway to Heaven
8 - Depeche Mode - Personal Jesus
8 - Ozric Tentacles - Iscence
8 - The Church - Reptile
8 - Seal - Crazy
8 - The Who - Bargain
8 - Massive Attack - Teardrop
8 - Sivert Hoyem - Prisoner of the Road
8 - Porcupine Tree - Stars Die
8 - Stevie Wonder - Superstition
8 - Nick Lowe - Cracking Up
8 - Robert Palmer - Johnny and Mary
8 - Crowded House - Private Universe
8 - Radiohead - These Are My Twisted Words
8 - Nat King Cole - (Get Your Kicks On) Route 66
8 - Band of Horses - Factory
8 - U2 - New Year's Day
8 - Pink Floyd - Learning to Fly
7 - Shriekback - All Lined Up
7 - Habib Koité & Bamada - Wassiyé
7 - Sonic Youth - Stones
7 - Steely Dan - Deacon Blues
7 - R.E.M. - What's The Frequency, Kenneth
7 - Natalie Merchant - Nursery Rhyme Of Innocence And Experience
7 - Moby - Look Back In
7 - Papa Wemba - Sala Keba (Be Careful)
7 - Breaks Co-op - The Sound Inside
7 - Thievery Corporation - Forgotten People
7 - PJ Harvey - This Mess We're In (w/ Thom Yorke)
7 - Peter Murphy - Cuts You Up
7 - The Blue Nile - Tomorrow Morning
7 - Gorillaz - Stylo
7 - Eels - Mr E's Beautiful Blues
7 - Squirrel Nut Zippers - Blue Angel
7 - Kathleen Edwards - Goodnight, California
7 - The Doors - Cars Hiss By My Window
7 - Turin Brakes - Sea Change
7 - XTC - Greenman
7 - Joe Satriani - Sleep Walk |
I truly love this: What Am I Doing Hanging RoundMaybe I'm starting to come around to thinking even that which is shunned at the time by many music lovers and critics really isn't so bad? |
There are the gems, duds and everything in between all the time.
We change, times change and music changes accordingly.
Nothing stays the same.
Good thing too. Too much of any one thing tends to get boring over time. Even the good stuff. |
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The Beatles were and continue to be phenomenal but a side effect was many were indoctrinated to music by them and perhaps pay less attention to other forms that continue to thrive today. |
"There are two kinds of music.....good, and bad"
I agree with teh Duke on this. I find all music good enough to listen to at least once. More that I will give a second try based on the first than not. In the end the babies get separated from the bathwater.
"Painstakingly crafted to tweak the brain's delight in melody, rhythm, and repetition"
And the problem with that is......?
Oh yeah, its not "creative". is delivering more of a product most people like not creative? Most people just want to dance, not listen. Is dance music bad? I like to listen mainly and if it makes me want to dance then the litmus test has been passed. |
Most people danced to the music of Ellington. that's what made him popular. The genius came out over time.
People like to dance to modern music as well, at least younger people. There is likely at least a couple genius out there as well making this stuff. They might get tired of cookie cutter and do something else creative and great later. Like the Duke. How many of his contemporaries are still even known at all today? A small %.
The other day my 14 year old daughter informed me that she cannot enjoy a lot of teh modern pop she did anymore in that she realized that the music of the 80s and Michael jackson specifically is so much better. |
Most of anything, music whatever is average at best pretty much by definition. You always have to look harder to find the gems. The real ones tend to stick around longer. Most fade into oblivion with maybe a very limited fanbase at best. |
I hated NW for teh most part when it peaked. I like some of it now in that it came and went and don't have to hear it all the time anymore. Like most all pop music fads. |
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"Look harder before stating that contemporary music is crap"
++ |
Young people have not heard those same 8 notes nearly as many times as us old timers so chances are they are not nearly as jaded as us...yet...and better able to soak in new things and appreciate it. |
Rap is more expressive story telling accompanied by music. Some similarity to the blues there.
Rock is more about an expressive musical style accompanied by lyrics.
They all have lyrics and convey messages but the messages differ in terms of the culture influencing them and that of the target audience.
Like reading a book, listening to music is a way of hearing about the experiences of others and relating to those perhaps in some way. Rap is well designed for this it seems to me. The music serves more as an accompaniment than it is the feature. Kind of like a more rhythmic form of ballad.
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It would be interesting to hear what Eminem might come up with in his golden years. I hope he makes it there.
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