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Another soundstage question

There are a couple of soundstage related threads running on the amp/preamp section and they reminded me of a question I’ve been meaning to ask without hijacking those threads. The speakers are Vandersteen 2Ci and the system along with their placement is giving me a real deep and relatively wide soundstage - but not much further to the sides, but I’d like the height of the soundstage be little higher. The speakers are on the sides of a bay window, about 10’ apart and with heavy drapes pulled on either side and about 2.5’ behind the speakers. Much lighter curtains cover the bay windows for privacy. In my seating position that is about 10’ away from each speaker the top of the soundstage is just about the top of the speakers, sort of like I’m sitting at the same level as the musicians. The depth is realistic but I think the height needs to higher to give a better feel for the height of the singer standing in the middle and the rest of the band scattered at different levels within the stage. So having said all this, is the soundstage height mostly a function of the electronics driving the speakers or its the size/shape of the speakers, e.g., speaker height, tilt, etc., the listening placement, or a combination of all of the above. Thanks.

128x128kalali
kalali's avatar
kalali OP
1,645 posts
 

Thanks gentlemen for your very helpful suggestions. I think I need to start with some test tracks, as was suggested, to first establish a baseline and adjust my expectation from my gear. As one of you said, I might be chasing the holy grail of audio and may have hit the limits of what my moderate system is capable to deliver. Taller speakers would definitely help - (did someone say Tekton DI or there’s an echo in the room?!). I’ll also experiment with all the free options you all mentioned and see how much I can stretch the soundstage without compromising all the other elements like imaging, width, etc.

I may give Johnny R a call tomorrow and ask his opinion as well. He’s been extremely helpful in answering all my questions about placement, matching gear, etc., without an even a hint in trying to sell me something. A real class act.

kosst_amojan
2,095 posts
 
Not all speakers do soundstaging well. Some put a bigger emphasis on tone. My Focals project a towering, deep, stage. Billy Gibbon's amp sounds like it's next to him on the floor. Danny Carey's drums sound 8 feet high. Near and far is vivid. I struggle with width on account of an asymmetric space. I never though much about the height of the speaker, but with 936's you're sitting well below the tweeter and dead on with the midrange. I don't think that accounts for the height of the sound. Room treatments are a help but don't unleash characteristics of the speaker it just doesn't have. 
geoffkait's avatar
geoffkait
14,147 posts
 
What you really want is the soundstage height to be in line with so to speak the rest of the soundstage dimensions, I.e., the width and depth. In other words the soundstage should approximate a sphere and should ideally represent the venue space of the recording, with great depth, width and height. Not only that but as the system improves you should notice an ever expanding sphere that is the soundstage. As the resolution gets better the subtle soundstage queues such as echo and reverberant decay become more apparent, as well as transparency, coherence, air, etc. If you have to resort to toe-in or tilt-up you’re a long long way from Tipperary. Get the soundstage right and the parameters like tone and detail will follow.
kosst_amojan
2,095 posts
 
Oh my God! I'm marking this day on my calendar because Geoff made a post I completely agree with!

Also worthy of mentioning, my other pair of speakers are 1975 ESS AMT1's and they're short little speakers. 30 inches tall in fact. I shim the AMT's up a little to aim them higher. Their height doesn't seem to make much difference on the size of the soundstage. It's still plenty tall, deep, and wide. I don't think the height of a speaker should dramatically change how it images for the most part. 
tomic601's avatar
tomic601
2,164 posts
 
my brother in law has 2ce they throw a very big and convincing sounstage
something in your setup not right...
distance from rear wall effects image depth most
i would check tilt first, then toe in and of course follow the vandersteen instructions.
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