$10k Speaker Cables??????????????

@bailyhill

would be greatly interested in your take on ND555

elizabeth
My speakers cost $14.850. My speaker cables (Kimber 8TC) cost $125, plus the cost of the WBT ends, (which are practically forever reuseable)                                      
Like Power cords, on this front I am cheap.                        
I have zero whine about expensive anything.

>>>Zero whine but not zero wine 🍷. Bottoms up!

"A fool and his money are soon parted"......Some people have more money than (cents) sense, BTW, I'm not rich, but if i were, i still wouldn't give up my (Cardas) unless i heard a really appreciative difference !!!

I imagine you would have to compare some other high end cable with Cardas in your system to determine if you might be overlooking some other cable. It’s kind of a catch 22. My old boss at NASA told me never get behind anyone 100%. 

You could look at 10k cables as all being relative.
I use $1200 cables on 4k speakers so roughly 30% of the cost of the speakers.
If you step that up it would only equate to a set of 34k speakers approx.
Now granted that is a little out of the average audiophile pocket but to some it is a price they would pay for their speakers so why not 10k for their cables?
It is then up to their ears if it was worth it or not.

I love to spend at least 10k for a great cable.

I seem to remember a set of used speakers for sale here at Audiogon for ~$450,000. I also seem to remember that each speaker had its own built in amplifier. That means you do not need amps/monoblocks or high dollar speaker cables, which really makes them a bargain.

I assume it also means that those of us who have $50k speakers with $10k cables just have no idea what really good equipment sounds like.

Of course the usual response seems to be "Well, I heard a million dollar system at a show and it didn’t sound any better than my $xxxxx.xx system." ;-)

OP asks "when will the madness end." It will end when everyone is as smart, savvy and knowledgeable as most of the "naysayers" on this forum. It will end when audiophiles "get" that when they spend exorbitant amounts on audio accessories, they are primarily concerned, not with the quality of their music, but with what their equipment says about them... to other naive beholders.

E.g.: no one buys a Rolex because it tells time better...because it doesn’t.

The answer: cryogenically treated 🐈💩. 

Whoa! What? Hey, did someone call for a troll convention?

“Build it and they will come.”

And here you are, Johnny at the rathole, eh, Kitty?  🙀🐈💩

Honestly even my teenage daughter has outgrown the poop emojis.......
Such advanced maturity and we wonder why this hobby and forums are dying.

🌬

Here is a really informative video from Ethan Winer giving background and demo of his Null Tester.   He uses to measure differences (or lack thereof) in audio cables.

https://youtu.be/ZyWt3kANA3Q

I love when Ethan Winer starts off by saying, engineers will tell you...blah blah blah. It’s funny because Ethan Winer isn’t an engineer. Get it? I kind of doubt that’s his voice if you want my honest opinion. Sounds like a robot. Well, maybe it is his voice, how do I know?

Spend more on your cables?

"And here you are, Johnny at the rathole, eh, Kitty?"

Mark Knopfler’s new album (out today) has an acknowledgment/thanks to....Kitty.

The Audionote room at the NY show had $15k speakers connected with $15k cables. Daft. 

O.K., Glupson, I cant find any acknowledgement of Kitty....🙀

The hobby is dying because the participates are aging out, and then dying. NO ONE is quitting listening to music because of any forum.They may stop posting! But not stop listening. Fer' sure.

So, you didn’t find the acknowledgement, either?

I got the top of the line Synergistic Research UEF speaker cable at half price and they were still a lot of money....but because I did so and purchased two REL subwoofer I am now very happy with the sound I am getting with my Harbeth 40.2 speakers and integrated pass lab 250.

I could have sold the speakers and tried some other speakers instead but who knows where I would be on the merry go round if I did so...

I could have bought a separate preamp and amp and stuck with a cheaper cable and maybe got to the same place but maybe not .....

the better speakers cables with the subwoofer make every record sound good to me...obviously some better than others....before.....I would be happy with one record and then with the next record be thinking maybe I should get a different speaker or amp.......

so my happiness and peace of mind is worth it......I would have found it much more taxing to sell the speakers or sell my equipment and audition something else......

my previous speaker cables were the lesser but still excellent atmosphere cables by SR and now they are happily being used in my bedroom set amp system.  So both systems sound better........

Nobody said people were stopping listening to music.......

Yes, indeed, the folks around here impute 💩 to others....🙀🙉🙈🙊

Yup, ole Kitty and his omnidirectional fuse.  Took the words right outta my mouth. 🏚

" Troll convention" sounds good to me.
ebm hates money so much that he uses every opportunity trying to free himself of it. Doesn't happen and looks almost hopeless.
I guess, $10k amp is no longer considered expensive. What makes people think that it is always more difficult to design great amp than design great cable ?
Great stuff, whatever it is, has the right to cost anything and go to the highest bidder. I would be more upset about $5k so-so cables than $10k excellent cables.

Where does this madness end??

It simply ends when people stop buying these. A person may have a $3000 amp connected to $10,000 cables if its cables that excite him. Rather than get better speakers, better amps, or God forbid, do something that really makes a difference like driving speakers directly with mutlitple amps via an eletronic crossover its all like putting lipstick on a pig. 

In the 1950s and 60s people built kits, made an effort to understand and be able to repair their own equipment. We are so far from that level of participation and knowledge. Evidently reviews, wildly expensive cables (fuses, power cords etc) delight people whose systems might sound a lot better with more knowedge than money.

To those who have the funds to throw around, these cables must bring some satisfaction. 

To parapharse Marshall McLuhan, "in the future the satisfaction of buying something will be entirely in the desire to want it, purchase it, one will go through the process of buying it but not need to have it. The product will simply be an idea sitting in the back of a file cabinet" 

With cables, fuses and other such things the satisfaction is mostly in talking about it. As we see in forums everywhere. The purveyors of these devices are as slippery as snake oil. They have no knowedge of what they do. I know because I have spoken to them.

https://www.marshallmcluhan.com/

I would like to insert a moment of calm. Breathe in.. savor the moment... breathe out.. relax... Breathe in... breathe out...Anyway, one comment I would like to toss in is gradual improvements.. Years go by... For example...
I spent a considerable sum back in 2010 when I retired. Bought speakers, amp preamp...
2 years goes by, during which I buy used Power conditioner, another used power conditioner. a few power cords, (low priced ones, but still aftermarket)
Year goes by, another year goes by.. Maybe even a third year goes by.. I decide finally time to buy some fancy IC. I try one looks interesting. OK, I buy a few more over the next six months.Year goes by, I want more, buy VERY expensive IC, kind of important on, (7 meters from pre to amp). Six month later I buy two more short ones. another year goes by, I buy yet two more of them.(I like them)2018 January.. I have five grand in the bank.. Think well, do I want new speakers? I think get 3.7i Magnepan to replace my 3.6??? After pondering for a month, I decide to just go for the big jump, no lateral move for me. I decide to by Magnepan 20.7s.Then after a few more months I buy a new SACD/DAC device. Then a few upgraded powercords, still cheap ones, considering, but spent $1,600 Enough. A few more months and I get the urge to buy a few fancy duplex. Notice I am on a roll here, shades of 2010.
Oh yes, did you notice. NO new Speaker cables?
Now I know several folks will scorn me for NOT buying some, and the other half dozen would scorn if I did. Do I care? Breathe in... relax... breathe out... Are we having fun yet?The point I was slowly and steadily Breathe in.... Breathe out... making is TIME. Most folks spend a very great deal of time gathering all the audio junk they possess. If you noticed, in my years, one odd purchase, a $3,200 interconnect. This was a big deal for me, but it was worth it. Maybe for someone else it might have been a $10,000 pair of speaker cables? Maybe it was the only purchase in several years? Just a consideration.

Boxes of fancy wires......that is what this hobby is. Spend a few bucks, spend thousands....but don’t be fooled you are buying boxes of fancy wires.

What the world needs is a better mouse 🐁 trap. Build a better mouse 🐁 trap and they will beat a path to your door. The sales of aftermarket premium fuses has not slowed down, it has not tapered off, or stopped. It has accelerated. That’s why the total of fancy fuses is at currently at least 80,000, and accelerating. The great majority of which are HiFi Tuning and Synergistic Research fuses, but a tip of the hat 🎩 to Audio Magic Beeswax 🐝 and Isoclean, you know, the one for fuse paranoids who worry about UL listing.

My mousetrap was just building a WALL. The mice would wander.. I made a 4" tall cardboard wall across the floor, except at one wall, were I placed an empty standard mousetrap. The wall made the mouse step on/over on the trap. BLAM SNAP! dead mouse(s).That was in my last residence. The current place I had killed over 40 mice in 3 years.. Now they chose to annoy some other person less interested in murdering them. The caretaker seemed to not care, I even nailed mice to his door, handed him live ones in a jar. Nope.
As for wires.... Jeesh like no one KNEW they were buying wires? Who would have guessed? Maybe they thought they were buying "Audio Jewelry"? or Classic Action Figures? or Fine Art? or 'Investing in Gold"

The cable debate goes on.  Do what works for you. I’m that makes you love what you hear buy what you can afford. You judge the fidelity and if it sounds good do it. 

C'mon GEORGE!

You threw this out here, where are you?

Talk about making a troll post!

The "T" word/ It is curious I have seen folks call out the "T" word over and over. I have yet to see a real live genuine TROLL thread. Sure some can seem a bit like it ’might have been’ someone jokingly acting a bit trollish. But not a real troll. So Why is calling troll so popular? Maybe because folks can’t use the "N" word anymore? Nor the "R" word? So they grab for a word they can sling out there and seem to be saying something insulting? IMO the "T" word should be banned.IT does NOTHING to progress any discussion, and is only used to insult someone else the person DOES NOT LIKE. Seems to have zero to do with any actual language, or words, or style. Just a way to hurl a general insult. Sort of like flinging offal or dead animal entrails.

If you look at the product, there is at least some innovative engineering involved.  They didn't just paint the wires a different color and jack the price with every iteration, or every color change (if the shoe (fuse) fits...).

What they charge for it, and what people pay, is of no concern to me....we call it "free enterprise."  This is no more "madness" than what you see in many industries selling luxury items.  If you don't want to pay $10K, or don't have that much money for speaker cables, then there are plenty of other options.  For example;

Neotech has a speaker cable with similar (but not quite the same), single-wire winding geometry, but in a less complicated design;

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/speaker-neotech-nes-3001-upocc-pure-solid-copper-core-sold-by-the-meter-unterminated-neotechs-t-2017-01-19-cables-90504-torrance-ca

I have used the troll descriptor in regards to an OP who deliberately creates a thread that he knows is going to be extremely contentious and then does a complete disappearing act.

In my mind it fits perfectly and that is my opinion and mine alone. Not forcing that on anybody.

Next snide snarky dig Elizabeth?

My apologies to Mr. Moderator and others for my profanity....one too many beers. haha

Alcohol is an excuse, not a justification. 🐈💩

I beg to differ. Alcohol is kind of mandatory for pilots, you know, what with the long excruciatingly boring flights. 👨🏻‍✈️🚎 🍻 cheers!

True!  I'm not one to drop an F bomb on any forum but when I saw this one, it was my first gut reaction/thought!  

Ha, ha, Kitty!  Envy will get you nowhere. Kat 💩 (Schitt) still stinks, and imbues every cognate matter with that stink. Good metaphor, really. As for boredom, try making a near zero/zero approach in a driving rainstorm at an unfamiliar airport, with a high density altitude knowing the stakes. That’ll wake you up. 

Folks, the topic is not the issue. It’s because some posters believe denigrating or attacking others that hold differing perspectives somehow improves their position. They attack the messenger instead of the message. It appears they don’t understand that facts and logic stand on their own merit without immature bolstering. That an opinion is simply that; an opinion. It’s not an attack on their beliefs.

AudiogoN is supposed to be an place to hang out and discuss a subject that brings us all enjoyment. A hobby that provides a haven from the stresses of the world. Sadly, discussions on political Web sites are often more polite than those here. Threads like this are why I largely ignore AudiogoN’s discussion groups. I got to this discussion through a link AudiogoN sent via email. My mistake. Thanks for reminding me that a once pleasurable place to hang out has had the fun sucked out of it.

$10K cables? Not going to happen here, though the design is interesting. Kind of a cross between Litz and Air insulation. Wonder if the designers ever considered adding a liquid insulator (ala, Purist Audio Aqueous)...

Yeah, that’s it! We used to walk ten miles to school in the snow, barefooted and uphill both ways, but we loved it!

Right, never say bs to something inherently incredible, improbable or unreasonable.

BS. 🙀

we all know what an ad hominem is, and Kitty is always Johnny at the rathole with one as above. Do you think any rational person would pyramid inferences like being an air transport pilot is boring, boredom results in drinking and therefore transport pilots drink while flying. QED.

Scrape the Kat 💩 off your shoe man, though no doubt the stink will linger.

I’m constrained to ask: do you use a ladder to get down from that high horse?😱

Assuming that was aimed at me (though like a true cowardly troll you don’t get too specific about the target) allow me to use this ladder to lower myself to your level.

Bite me.

Feel better?

😿

maritime51,

If you take a new Mark Knopfler CD Down The Road Wherever (Deluxe, but it should be on all), check the booklet. One of the right pages (second half of the booklet, I think) and on the right side, upper half, has many names mentioned and the last is Kitty.

I already ripped the CD and put it in the crate so it is buried relatively deep, otherwise I would go and check what page it is on.

Context?

I think it is just thanking people who helped him, not much else. It says Kitty and I read it just minutes after a string of posts here mentioning word "Kitty" so I thought I would let you know. I doubt it is to "your" Kitty, but maybe he really is an insider as he claims.

I think it says "...and, of course...Kitty" or something to that effect.

🐈💩 is 🐈💩👀