oregonpapa
The magazines very seldom have anything negative to say about any product reviewed. The rave reviews go to the manufacturers who pay for ads in the magazine.
>>>>Huh? There are perfectly good reasons why the major magazines generally won’t post negative reviews. Please give me a break. It has nothing to do with honesty. That’s an old wives tale.
Another thing to be aware of is the music the "professional" reviewers use to evaluate the equipment being tested. If you check their music out on a source such as Spotify, so much of it is drenched in artificial digital reverb. Its crap. It leaves you wondering how a reviewer can hear what the equipment really sounds like.
>>>>What? Never heard of that before. Got any examples? It doesn’t make sense. And if it doesn’t make sense it’s not true. It certainly does not (rpt not) have anything to do with honestly, anyway.
cheers, GK |
It’s not based on crack, is it?
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toetapaudio
It would be good to have the designers view on what led him to the design of the mat and what he thinks it is doing. I presume it’s similar to other products by Bybee, SR and Akiko which work by absorbing RFI and EMF.
>>>>>Huh? First of all magnets don’t absorb, attract or shield RFI or EMI. Nor can magnets bend or attract or absorb light. Second, even if it did there are much less expensive ways to absorb or shield RFI/EMI, for example draping a Carbon Fiber cloth over the component. Third, even if magnetic material shielded or absorbed RFI it would have to be wrapped completely around the component. What the mat might do, being magnetic, is absorb magnetic fields, which could be done cheaply with mu metal. |
Satire. Damage Control. What’s the diff?
Besides, I’m pretty sure unterwaltz meant to say effectiveness instead of efficiency. A small thing, perhaps, but an irritating one. 😠
🤡 |
fleschler
I was mistaken as to the use of the magnetism in the mat. It is apparently only used for attaching to or attracting the mat to the device or surface.
>>>>No harm, no foul. We all enjoying trying to figure out how new tweaks work. Got a second choice for how the mat works? Share, share... |
Pop quiz:
What the heck is in the mat? (Multiple Choice)
1. Crushed Tourmaline and quartz crystals
2. Quantum dots
3. Alternating layers of mu metal and Graphene
4. Buckeyballs
5. Higgs boson particles (God particles)
6. PWB Morphic Message Foils
7. Amber with fossilized prehistoric insects
8. Smart metal
9. Depleted uranium
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The outside of the breaker box? Interesting. Does it work by quantum tunneling?
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Try them under the server. See what happens.
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Interesting. What products did you remove? What other parameters besides dynamics and air did you look for? I’m not totally sure I would intimate that everyone else would experience your results.
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Yeah, but you were not (rpt not) a beta tester. The beta testers were the subject of the quid pro quo debate, not later customers.
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Another thing to try is separate mats from each other by 1/4” when stacking them using cotton cloth or some other similar material to see if that improves effectiveness. |
Ah, the gentlemanly sport of whack a mole in which amg56 takes one for the team. 👳♂️ |
Wow, amg56, for a second there I thought you said light headedness.
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Nope. The magnetism has already been explained as simply a way to attach the mat to steel surfaces. If it operated via magnetism you could just attach a large magnet plate to the chassis or breaker panel door. It would be a whole lot cheaper. Besides the ERS cloth doesn’t work in most places. It hurts the sound. Which explains why the sound was better once it was removed. Hel-loo! The ERS cloth is the poster child for expectation bias.
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theaudiotweak
If you move the E Mat less than 1/2 inch away from a ferrous material or shelf there is 0 pull force..I think there will be virtually 0 chance of magnetic interference while using the E Mat with any product.
>>>>Well, there is the inverse square law to consider, I suppose. But the slightly magnetic mat ain’t going to help adhere to the surface if it’s not ferrous, which many things aren’t. The question is whether magnetism is part of how the mat works.
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jetter
I like ozzy's "cutting" idea, and it would be interesting if you could let us know what a cross section looks like. Does it appear to be all the same and the same material, or stratified layers of differing materials? If Tim has already answered this, sorry for the duplicate, but not up to reading the whole post at this time.
I for one would also like to know if anyone takes one to NASA for a good once over with a scanning electron microscope or if the word REDRUM is visible to the naked eye.
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Oregonpapa
In a hobby where there are phono cartridges costing $15,000, line stages in excess of $30,000, amps in excess of $100,000 and speakers in excess of $250,000, $600 for a mat seems paltry.
I applaud your impeccable logic. 😛
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Well, he is absolutely within his rights to hide the secrets of his product. When people talk about cutting the mat open and other questions I would discourage that sort of thing too. Who wouldn’t? Hel-loo! I had a skeptic take an Intelligent Chip (which wasn’t even my product!) to a metallurgist to try to determine the metals and other material used in its construction, not realizing the active ingredient (artificial atoms) was sandwiched between the two thin discs, out of view of the scanning electron microscope. 😛
Never smarten up a chump and never ever give a sucker an even break. |
Frank, I wasn’t making your point. Never mind.
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What’s ethics got to do with anything? 😬 |
Make something cheap enough and ever the most die hard skeptic folds like a little girl. Even when they’re told magnetism is not the method of operation. It never fails. 😛 |
On the other hand your friend and humble narrator has been using magnets of various types sizes and colors for nigh on twenty years. So, there’s that. It’s a question of knowing where they go and so forth. Also, they are not particularly powerful. So, there’s that.
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lpretiring
I would guess the level of intensity has something to do with effectiveness as well. I bet mine will stay in place at 100 mph!
See my previous post, which I just amended to address intensity. The reason eMats are more effective when stacked probably is not (rpt not) a function of magnet intensity. You said it yourself - strong magnets hurt the sound. Hel-loo! The trick is knowing WHAT TO MANIPULATE. And that whole subject is unfortunately one of those unmentionable subjects and beyond scope.
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It’s not how cheap you are. It’s what you know. 😀 For example, the induced magnetic field of large transformers is not (rpt not) good for the sound. Which is why wrapping transformers with low frequency high permeability alloy improves the sound by absorbing the magnetic field. Or for speaker magnets, high frequency high permeability alloy. By the same token it’s customary to DE-magnetize cables, CDs and LPs, not to magnetize them. Trying to use magnets to “manipulate” the sound is like shooting blanks in the dark. Magnets don’t somehow smooth the signal, reduce noise or distortion, or any such thing.
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Full court press. Then man to man defense. Excellent, excellent....⛹️♂️ ⛹️♂️ ⛹🏻♂️ ⛹🏽♂️ ⛹🏻♂️
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troutchoker
If a company cannot explain what it is selling it is usually selling air or feathers. ( junk.)
Whoa, hey, hold on there, troutchoker! There are many perfectly good reasons why a company cannot or should not explain a product it’s selling.
In no particular order,
1. He doesn’t know the explanation or doesn’t know how to explain it technically.
2. He wishes to keep the details SECRET. You know, so someone doesn’t steal his idea.
3. He decided to keep the details SECRET in lieu of pursuing a patent, which can be very expensive.
4. He wishes to build suspense and drama.
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fleschler
354 posts
07-19-2018 7:15pm
Geoff-The High Fidelity cables do exactly what you think of magnets added to cables, they increase the noise and distortion. The former proud owner of them complained that his system lacked smoothness. When I heard it, it sounded like garbage coming our of the AvantGarde Trios and 3 pairs of Basshorns. All the instruments were like in bass relief, outlined but lacking in body with disjointed frequency range (separate lows, highs, mids). After installing a more conventional (but an extremely elaborate and patented) set of speaker, A/C and IC cabling, his audio system sounded really enjoyable.
>>>>There could be some explanation why you heard what you did. The High Fidelity Cables are not really an example of using magnets on cables, but an example of magnetic conduction. With all the positive testimonies and reviews of High Fidelity Cables I tend to believe that they probably sound very good and that something unknown produced those negative results in your friend’ system. Who knows what?
to whit, this excerpt of the review of High Fidelity cables in 6 Moons,
“The entry-level CT-1 introduces something quite unusual which immediately suggests that you're in high-end territory with a very liquid extended soundstage. But the most salient feature is their apparent naturalness. I have always considered it very difficult to combine a very lively music reproduction with a good level of neutrality.
”The CT-1 speaker cables sat undoubtedly closer to Nordost than Cardas but were bit less ethereal than Valhalla to get closer to my concept of a truly universal wire. Bandwidth seemed extended but lacked some weight in the low end and the treble wasn’t as sweet and refined as the Nordost Valhalla. On the flip side the Yanks had the better midrange and balance than Nordost. The profusion of low-level detail was in the top range of many cables I know. These resolved a tremendous quantity of small nuance from the mid bass to the upper treble. They also cast a wide and deep soundstage with an amazing quietness like the AudioQuest K2 but with much better tone and dynamics.”
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steakster
This doesn't make one right or wrong. Having gone to many audio shows over the years, I've heard speakers that others have loved, but didn't do anything for me at all. It's all subjective.
>>>>See, I have a somewhat different experience, also having been to many shows and having been part of many high end systems at shows. I rarely hear anything that sounds really good and much that sounds really bad. |
One reason it’s not really fair to discuss High Fidelity Cables in the context of magnetic fields and using magnets or demagnetizers in audio systems is because High Fidelity Cables use magnets for the actual conduction of the signal (I.e., magnetic conduction, his term) as opposed to trying to “manipulate the signal.”
Also it should be pointed out that the conductive element in HFC is not copper or silver but a high permeability alloy, you know, for absorbing/shielding magnetic fields. I suspect a pretty good cable or power cord could be made using that same high perm alloy in lieu of copper or silver and just skip the magnets. You know, since the current flowing through the conductor produces a magnetic field, one that is most likely not too good for the sound. Yes, I know what you’re thinking, well, what about all the other wire and cabling in the system, including the internal speaker wire and transformers? Bingo! 😛
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“Painstakingly designed.” Ah, a true artist, willing to suffer for his art. 😩 |
Quick interrupt. I received my cheapo magnetic mats from eBay yesterday and put three mats under my trusty portable Panny CD player, made in Japan. I listened to a CD I am quite familiar with and got nothing. I also got nothing on my hopped up LG HD TV with stacked magnetic mats on my flat TV amplified antenna.
I do get good repeatable results, on the other hand, with the Walker Talisman degausser (that’s a demagnetized to you civilians) on CDs, on the player itself and on the headphone cable. If it doesn’t make sense it’s not true. - Judge Judy |
I will try again with the cheap magnetic sheets around the TV and on the Blu Ray player. Will wait till after dark to do any kind of evaluation.
The Talisman is also effective on interconnects. |
Say, isn’t Ozzy the same dude that complained a bunch of times about the graphene contact enhancer? Beware the disgruntled controversial tweak customer.
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Never smarten up a chump and never give a sucker an even break. 😬
Loose lips 👄 sink ships 🚢 |
The problem with this particular instance of reporting less than stellar performance is that he’s a disgruntled customer who has been gunning for the manufacturer for at least a year. Hel-loo!
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lpretiring
@geoffkait
"he’s a disgruntled customer who has been gunning for the manufacturer"
What are the posts where you concluded jaded Ozzy’s evaluation of this product? I along with I feel many others believe Ozzy conducts himself in this forum within a very high level of integrity, and based his review on his real findings and feelings. He also requested to hold on to the mat a little longer to test for additional gains that could develop.
>>>>Search the archives. I don’t have the time or inclination to do it for you.
Is it possible that you might be sensitive from too many conflicts over products you tried to market?
>>>>I’m not the sensitive type. I’m just going by what Ozzy posted time and time again about the TC product, the first batch of which he beta tested. I’m no. 1 here on Agon on sales and feedback so I wouldn’t be so quick to disparrage my products if I were you.
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But why is he on this thread at all? |
uberwaltz
Geoffkait: But why is he on this thread at all?
Are you kidding me?
>>>>Would I kid you?
Does anybody need a reason or permission to be on a thread here now?
Give me a break.....
>>>>>I didn’t say they did. I actually don’t care if some has an axe to grind. Grind away, baby!
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“My audio system sounds great.”
You know, after this expression is used more than 10,000 times it kind of loses its impact. But seriously, I’m curious why customers seem to have such a hard time expressing what the sonic changes are that these products bring to the table. Cat 🐱 got your tongues 👅?
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“Dynamic and lifelike” are not really what I was hoping for. I’m not looking for reasons why your system sounds like it does but detailed descriptions of the sound, especially what you can attribute to the new products. Never mind.
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oregonpapa
”....it was like a veil was lifted as the noise floor lowered dramatically. I could "see" into the sound picture more clearly than before. It was way more three dimensional in nature.
With the installation of the Omega E Mats, there was a lot more there there than with just the TC alone. Now, I have a reach-out-and- touch-it type of thing going on. The sound space and the musicians within it are super clear and detailed without any negatives at all. I was listening to a "Poll Winners" CD last night with Shelly Mann on drums. I swear to you that drum set was in the room. The whack of the rim shots - amazing. The rattle of the snare drum - amazing. The brassiness of the cymbals - real.”
>>>>>Corny 🌽 as Kansas in August. Normal as blueberry pie.
Note to self: Is he hot doggin me? 🌭
Geez, now I’m getting hungry again.
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If I’m not mistaken, the inventor already addressed the magnetic field theory by revealing the new smaller mats are not (rpt not) magnetic. The large mats were magnetic only so they could be easily attached to ferrous surfaces like a breaker panel door. Generally speaking, don’t audiophiles generally try to eliminate magnetic fields, not introduce them?
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Earth to uberwaltz, nobody I know ever pays full price. Ever. Especially if someone buys 11 of something. I doubt he did. Especially if he’s a beta tester. Follow? I wouldn’t be surprised if you paid full price, however. No reason for all the attutude, Bubba.
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I don’t think that’s what he said. Well, not exactly, anyway.
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Uh, that’s not what *you* said, though.
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“Congratulations on the further improvement of your system with the second Omega E Mat. It is difficult to verbalize the improvement in a system as additional Mats are installed and then become stabilized after being in place for Two weeks. My audio systems are now more emotionally moving and stimulating.Trying to verbalize the why of this effect I will leave to others.” WOW! You don’t see that too much. Difficulty verbalizing the improvement to the sound and no attempt whatsoever to speculate how these things work. And he has eleven of them! 🙄 For anyone having difficulty expressing himself or identifying characteristics of sound you might consider consulting several sources of audiophile terminology, One such compendium of terms was developed by J. Gordon Holt. His book is found on Amazon here, https://www.amazon.com/Audio-Glossary-J-Gordon-Holt/dp/0962419141Here is the link to the Stereophile magazine longish Glossy of Audiophile Terms, https://www.stereophile.com/content/sounds-audio-glossary-glossaryand this list of audiophile terms from head-fi.org, https://www.head-fi.org/threads/describing-sound-a-glossary.220770/ |
You gotta hand it to Frank. He’s got chutzpah. Probably learned from all those years selling farm implements.🤡
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I think I have a lump in my throat. No, wait. Never mind, it was some Budweiser. |
